Things That Piss Me Off: A Compendium

well yes or errrrr uhhhhh no.

its complicated.

and its called "affirmative action". !---> http://www.google.com <---!

 

I believe that affimative action was brought into play soon after it was discovered that SAT's have sort of a racial filter built into them. Some study or other showed that the kids of rich, white folks tended to score higher than their "minority" counterparts. Think about it: segregation existed in our country -- OFFICIALLY -- a scant few decades ago. Another handful of decades before that there was legal slavery. Racial bias is a problem that is seemingly receding yet still present in very real ways. The SAT's weren't created by a perfectly racially equal set of people; they were made by rich, white folks. Therefore, the views that they brought to the creation of the SAT's was somewhat ethnocentric and that has not gone completely away.

Also, many people hold self-fulfilling beliefs and this has found its way into the educational system. Example: teacher A believes that student B is just a "'hood rat" and teacher A's expectations of that student are lowered, and then this is reflected in the marks that student B receives. This has to be taken into account.

Now, I'm not saying I'm for affirmative action. It seems to me that it's America's way of covering up the past in its pursuit of "justice" and "equality". Reverse-bias is still a bias but it is looked at as a sort of recompense for inequalities born. Shifting inequality about as they are doing is just as bad as creating it in the first place. But what's done is done.

 

Chalupa. The public education curriculum doesn't change from school to school, maybe state to state, but not school to school. The same things are taught in the upper class areas in Nassau county as in Harlem. The skill of the teachers may change, NYC teaching jobs pay less so the suburbs have the pick of the group since they pay much higher.

You are right. Racism does exist, but how does instituting a racist system solve anything? Define racism. Is it treating certain individuals differently based on the color of their skin? Just because it treats blacks better than whites instead of the opposite doesn't mean it isn't just as wrong. We, as a people, will NEVER be able to overcome racist beliefs as long as we institute any policy based on race in any form. Now I'm not against racial pride, but we can't give minorities or majorities extra benefits under the law. Are the hispanics to turn into the elite of American society? Are they to be oppressed instead? Why can't we just say they are to be Americans?

Nothing can be said about a teacher's personal feelings. What can be said? You cannot make a law that will appease every single person in this country. And if a teacher holds a personal feeling towards a student, that's their right to their own opinion. If that affects their work however, then it's a different story, and the student can file a complaint.

Math cannot be ethnocentric. There are no racist views in calculus, and it's the teacher's or the student's fault if the student doesn't learn it, not the makers of the SATs. The English portion is more open to racism, put they tend to tred that line VERY carfully. Most of those sections are definitions etc., and I've never seen define nigger on any paper. The reading passages tend to be just as fair, on my last PSAT there was a passage by Langston Hughes I believe, and one about the ozone layer.

With the integration of schools it's very hard to ensure that only white kids learn material. At my school, most of the black kids tend to do worse then the whites, just as it turned out, but 13 of the top 25 kids are black, so they are being taught the material. If they choose to learn it, that's their decision.

 

Chalupa, the rich kids get good grades because they went to private schools and got good educations and know how to deal with stuff like percimon:fruit::quill: ? What changes could you suggest? Analogies in ebonics?

 

I'd first like to point out that racial pride is analogous to reverse-bias. Give it some thought. If you don't see why, don't feel ashamed to ask me to explain it. I would be happy to indulge you.

Certainly, students have the choice of whether they'd like to learn the curriculum or not, but it is the way that that curriculum is presented that concerns me. Math is, too, ethnocentric. Ever heard of Euclidean geometry and its counterpart, non-Euclidean?? They are two ways of looking at an isomorphism which take completely opposite tacks to begin with. Euclidean geometry has gaps which non-Euclidean geometry fills, and vice versa. Certain cultures may stress symbolic over literal manipulation, and perhaps it would be better to start children of these cultures on algebra or calculus as opposed to addition and multiplication tables. 1+1=1 can be very strongly argued depending on what values you assign to the symbol "1", and not just the numeric kind. English, as you say, is more ethnocentric than mathematics. Most authors presented in this type of curriculum are of European descent. Perhaps the author is from South Africa, or Viet Nam, but I can almost guarantee you that they have received a European education and are therefore tainted by the Westernizing influence. They are just that much farther from the viewpoint that their original culture has taken.

Not all "rich kids" go to private schools, and being a "rich kid" does not necessarily imply that one will get a "good" education. Besides, recent studies show that a private education is probably of lower quality than one might get at any public venue, which isn't saying much. I think that the educational system needs to take a more open-minded course in conveying to the students that the world is composed of a cornucopia of cultures. Ebonic analogies might be an alright start but it is still too ethnocentric and therefore biased.

Take the example of a news article I read today. The Senate has just pronounced partial birth abortions legal, when several months ago they affirmed a woman's right to terminate a pregnancy. The two views seem contradictory at first glance, but look past that to who has constructed the views: a room of, primarily, stodgy, old, rich, white men (i.e. Senators). Doesn't it seem a little quirky to you that women were largely excluded from this process, something which pertains almost solely to women?? The same thing has happened to our educational system, just on a larger scale. I think that for a truly equal system of education to be brought into being, it must be done so by a group of truly equal individuals. Representatives for each of the races -- and an equal distribution of both sexes -- must be brought together to formulate a system of education which stresses equality among diversity, and each of the representatives must have an equal say. This is not an impossibility unless one sets out with that mindset.

 

Chalupa, doesn't isn't that largely due to the fact not nearly as many women run as men? If aa women runs, and presents a better argument as to why she should be in office then a man, she will be elected. Obviously the number of men outnumber the number of women in Congress, but you can't really blame anyone for that except the women who didn't run. Congress has been chosen to make our laws. And if they don't end up with the perfect spread of racial mixes in america, chalk it up to the fact less than 50% of americans vote, and how only stodgy, old, rich, white men seem to be running. Don't blame Congress for the shape it's in. The voters have decided that's the way it should be. If they change their minds later, great, but until they do this is the best it's getting. Would you prefer we have 18 different Senates and only have people directly affected vote on matters?

No it's not IMPOSSIBLE for your ideas to be made reality. It's very unlikely and somewhat naive, and even somewhat stupid, but not impossible. Why should Native Americans have the same amount of power in legislature as Hispanics? There are less natives than hispanics, and certainly most laws would affect more hispanics than natives, just being that there are so many more of them.

That whole section on math being biased is bullshit, and doesn't deserve an answer, but I'm bored so why not. The math we use is the math we use. 'Certain cultures may stress symbolic over literal manipulation.' A very nice way of saying bullshit if you ask me. If you say X + X = 2X, how the fuck is the kid going to know that without basic addition? No matter WHAT fucking culture they come from, you cannot do algebra without at least some preface in arithmetic. Yes, you COULD say if 1 was set equal to 0, 1 + 1 = 1 would work. But no one in America does that. And you seem to not be able to realize that you cannot set up a system that will do things 120 different fucking ways.

If every individual went to a different class, and learned things only with people of their culture, what would that be? Segregation I think. And wouldn't adding all those people back into society after years of only being with people of their ethnicity be putting us back 2000 years? Racism would run rampant. Nothing would be accomplished at all. You want ebonics? Fine, why not Korean tests too? Why not tests in every single language, we can even have people come in and read off answers in Swahili.

America is called the melting pot for a reason. If you want to say the writers were 'tainted' with European influence, hasn't that same European culture in America been 'tainted' by every other culture that's here? This culture is mostly European, maybe it should be, the Europeans set up this country. But living in America isn't like living in any European country. There are a billion and one examples of blends between the European culture and Latin, Chinese, African, Japanese, Native American, and an almost infinite amount of other cultures. We don't teach our students British culture, we teach them American, and if you live in this country, and want to be a citizen, you have to, even if you don't want to assimilate completely, learn to understand our culture.

Everyone is America is taught that 1 = 1, it isn't some secret only white kids are exposed to. Maybe 3 cultures on the face of the planet would prefer algebra before arithmetic, but how can you make an educational system cater to every single individual like that? I would prefer not having any tests, and getting grades based solely on looks. Should we implement that system as well? What about some of the hunter-gatherer civilizations? Some still exist, should they go to the closest farm and learn to kill cows? It could be like a field trip... If a parent is adamant about their child learning sybolic math before numeric, they can get a tutor, or teach the kid themselves, while a majority of kids can learn math the way they would prefer.

People shouldn't expect to come to America and not assimilate, at least to a certain degree. Yea, keep your traditions, but we drive on the right side of the road, and the day that the government closes most of it's offices is Sunday. If in your culture driving on the right is a sign of weakness, and Sunday is the day you work especially hard, you'll need to adapt a little. If you want a car, you'll have to be weak, and if you only want to drive in the left lane fine, but that's the only way you'll drive. And you'll have to get used to your job most likely being closed Sundays. Go lift weights and run around the block 50 times if you want, but you'll need to adjust.and in response, maybe one of the neighbors will like that dish you want with eggplants and rice. When immigrants come to America they need to adjust to our culture, our way of math included, and in response, Americans will take on some of the cultural features of the immigrant's race/creed.

 

Going over your post, Blinky, without first glancing back at my own I'd think I was a pro-segregation, pro-dictatorship racial supremacist. Then I look back at what I've written in my previous post. Please, do the same. Bring along a dictionary if some of the larger words boggle your comprehension. You ask some good questions but your answers leave something to be desired, in my opinion.

 

All of you are talking about affirmative action, but noone has mentioned the kind of people students have to deal with because of that bullshit.

I mean, I am going to a private college, and before I started school I was lead to believe that because of the school's name and reputation it would be hard to get in.

However, now that I am half done with the program I realize how truly pathetic our education system is. Wherein even so called private schools are subject to affirmative action.

I go to school with some of the most ignorant, backwater, pig fucking, goat roping, imbecilic, redneck, zero common sense, dumbass, cheating, lazy, worthless, unpassionate, piece of shit, sons of bitches on the planet. [no offense meant to anyone that may be classified by one of those]

BTW - the military also falls under the dictatorship that in affirmative action(only in reverse)