Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Jungle Japes, Nov 5, 2006.
Hey Steampunk, please call me stupid one more time.
And that ladies and gentlemen is called denial.
Stupidity and denial.
I'm not a conspiracy theory fan.
I'm a realist.
And on that note, this is no conspiracy theory.
This is a fully testable and highly probable conspiracy theory.
Such as the theory of gravitation of the big bang.
By the way, Retard. You aren't just stupid. Your a Moran.
TWO POINTS FOR YOU!
Not only are you a conspiracy theorist troll, you're an illiterate conspiracy theorist troll. Your kind invented the fucking language, why not use it properly for a change, huh?*
Steel beams don't necessarily have to melt to get weakened.
Good to know though that there's no possibility whatsoever my house will ever collapse if a plane happens to crash into it. Thanks, Steampunk, for informing everyone just how stupid, sad and miserable your entire existence really is!
*Apparently there is a place called Moran in Kansas... but Retard's from Georgia, fuckhead.
Please. Your house does not have 47 specially made, huge high rise high density steel beams all through the middle.
Do yourself a favor. Just do a minimal amount of research. A fucking minimal amount will tell you everything you need to know. More so than the mainstream media of America or eurpope for that matter will let you know.
In fact ill help you along the way.
Ill comprise a short list of sources you may want to check up on.
The New Pearl Harbor
By David Ray Griffin
The 9/11 Commission Report---Omissions and Distortions
By David Ray Griffin
The War On Truth: Disinformation and the Anatomy of Terrorism
Painful Questions: Am Analysis of the September 11th Attack
By Eric Hufschmid
By Thierry Meyssan
American Assassination--The Strange Death of Senator Paul Wellstone
The Big Wedding: 9/11, the Wistle Blowers, and the Cover-up
By Sander Hicks
9/11 Synthetic Terror
By Webster Griffin Tarpley
Articles and Websites:
http://politics.guardian.co.uk/iraq/com ... 87,00.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story ... 17,00.html
When you have seen all the evidence and summed up all sides of the arguments and you have your answer talk to me again.
How about you shut up as long as you won't accept the fact that steel does not have to melt before it will break when there's a huge building on it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structural ... ompetition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_t ... nstruction
Im sorry about posting this but i feel that i really need to show you the structural integrity of these buildings and why they would not have collapsed due to "Fires" which is what was released and stated in the commissions report.
Each tower had 47 core columns running up the center of the building. The thickness of the walls in these columns varied from 4 inches thick at the ground to about a quarter inch at the very top of the tower.
There were also 236 exterior columns square shaped columns (Not rectangular like the core columns) running up the exterior of each tower.
Every floor had a network of steel trusses. There were two sets of trusses criss-crossing each other to form a rectangular grid. Corrugated steel pans were attached to the top of these trusses. Concrete was poured into those pans to form strong, flat and FIREPROOF floors. The exterior columns were spaced every meter along the outside of the towers. Windows were placed between the columns.
The exterior columns were further strengthened by steel plates. The plates were welded to the columns and then bolted to one another forming straps around the tower. Since the floors were spaced i think 12 feet apart it means each grid of trusses were repeated every twelve feet. The steel straps that wrapped around the tower were also repeated every twelve feet. As you can imagine that put a lot of steel into these buildings.
The empty space in the trusses was used for ceiling tiles, electric lights, air conditioning ducts and other utilities. It is important to realize that the framework of these towers was 100 percent steel.
By comparison, the building in Oklahoma city that Timothy Timothy McVeigh was accused of destroying had a concrete framework with steel reinforcing rods in the concrete.
Here is a very badly done picture of a cross section of the Tower looking down onto the concrete floor.
There were 47 Core Columns in the center of the tower. Even though only 4 are shown in the picture. There were 236 Exterior Columns but only 16 are shown. There exterior columns were literally outside of the building. Many people assume that the Towers disintegrated because they were weak, but there is no evidence for such an accusation. Rather, the photo's and descriptions from the people inside the towers prove that these towers were so strong that when the airplanes crashed into them, each tower merely swayed a bit in the opposite direction and then swayed back into there normal position. Both towers then remained motionless. People inside the towers felt them tilt but the movement was so small that neither photos nor video showed the tilting. Obviously these towers were incredibly strong. According to engineering websites that have technical data for these towers, the wind force that these towers had to withstand was greater than the for imparted on the towers by the airplanes. In other words, a strong enough wind had put more stress on the towers than the airplanes. The shear force of the winds onto the building was 11,000,000 lbs if a gust of wind came at 140 mph. So what caused these strong buildings to shatter into pieces? The official explanation is that fire did it. Since no fire has ever destroyed a steel structure before, and tests with jet fuel also could not, how could a fire destroy a building strong enough to handle the crash of a modern, wide bodied jet airliner. The only difference between the fires in the towers and conventional office fires is that thousands of gallons of jet fuel had splashed inside the towers. Is jet fuel capable of creating some monster fire capable of destroying steel buildings? The answer is no.
And by the way, the building was not on the steel. The steel is the framework of the building. And as such, it is kept up and supported by the steel, not the other way around. And even if ok, somehow these 4 inch thick steel beams did somehow break, (Every one of the 47 by the way) then surely it would have happened where the plane hit near the top of the building? Meaning that the top of the building would have in fact fallen off to the side of the building that was hit. The rest of the tower would have remained in tact. That is unless the weight of this chuck of building falling off the top weighed to much (and lets not forget that there would still be a connection of about 100 exterior beams in tact) that the whole building followed the collapse. But the thing is, it would not have collapsed straight down, it would have gone to the weakest side which is most likely the side that was hit.
Sorry to "double post" but i think a post of Xz's stupidity or lack of knowledge needed to be sorted out.
Why couldn't you have edited that into your previous post, moron?
Also, did you read the articles provided by Frigo?
Yes i did read them.
And they only went to further my point.
The critical temperature for steel is around 540Â°C.
That was said on wiki.
What was not said is that that fact is based on a variable. The variable being the mass of the steel. But for your sake. For the slow one known as Vyenna i shall use this temperature and explain it.
By the way, firemen reported that LOTS AND LOTS OF MELTED STEEL HAD BEEN FOUND AT THE BOTTOM OF THE TOWER. FULLY MELTED STEEL.
Well now that we are talking Â°C, the highest temperature this fire could have got, in perfect conditions is 800Â°C.
Now. If you look at the footage of the north tower you will see a large black hole where the plane has crashed. In this hole you do not see any flames from a fire. Any at all. What we do see however is a lot of smoke. This smoke shows us clearly that the fires were being starved of oxygen.
This fie can only reach 800Â°C if the hydrocarbons are mixed in the air in perfect conditions. These perfect conditions are reached only in a few controlled situations. Such as on a kitchen stove. This produces flames that are clean and blue rather than yellow. Even though stoves reach the maximum possible temperature they do not melt or shatter into pieces. So how could even lower temperatures cause the towers to disintegrate?
Look at this company known as CDI. "Controlled demolitions incorporated)
This company was used to clean up the mess at the world trade center.
They developed a special explosive and technique for demolishing steel structures. They are so proud of this technology that they trademarked its abbreviation. DREXS tm. Their British devision describes the technology as follows. "Our DREXS systems segment steel components into pieces matching the lifting capacity of the available moving equipment. Put simply this means if your trucks can hold pieces of steel up to 24 feet in length, then this company will cause all steal assemblies to brake in sections of 24 feet or less.
Look at the ruble of the WTC. Is it a coincidence that the entire steel framework of the Twin Towers, broke into pieces no longer than the trucks that were hauling them away? Only a handful of the thousands of pieces had to be cut with torches.
Somehow an off center fie, did exactly what a controlled demolition would do to a steel framed building. Five days later a geometrical log was taken on the temperatures of the ruble. By then you think the temperatures would have cooled by then. But, funnily enough, some areas temperatures were still as high as 1341Â°F. Strange indeed.
And why is it that these huge steel beams were moved in the first place? Isnt it a crime scene? Isnt it illegal to move things from the scene of a crime? Isnt it more illegal to have all of them beams driven to a port and shipped to japan and sold at really cheap prices? Only days after the collapse by the way?
The mass of the steel has nothing to do with it, if it's 560Â°C it doesn't matter whether it's mass is 1 kg or 500 tons.
Even if that is true, the fact is that the fires would not have got to that temperature. The starvation of oxygen shows that. Also, there was no fire in the base of the Tower. The only way that would be possible is if the jet fuel from the plane managed to work its way all the way down to the bottom of the tower.
Just stop dancing around the issue and open your eyes.
Im not really trying to make you feel stupid or bad. Im just trying to get you to understand.
If you believe this then please sign the petition on reopen911.org
If you give half a shit then get involved and so something.
Does anyone else see the irony in him calling Vyenna slow?
And this has anything to do with anything in what way?
Yeah, explosions do tend to take all the available oxygen.
Does the word 'explosion' tell you ANYTHING?
Do you have a source for this? I mean a VALID source, if you're basing this on what ever the fuck those conspiracy idiots say then it is not a valid source.
Again, source please? And even if they were that warm, how does that support your conspiracy theory in any way? I mean do you honestly believe that someone would gain anything from keeping them warm?
You've probably weren't there when the rescue work was going on, if you were, you'd have understood that just letting all the debris stay where they were, it'd be a hell of a lot harder to actually get anyone out of the ruins. Whether it was legal or not was probably not their first concern, saving people was. I'm sure glad you didn't lead that work, because then no one would've been saved after the collapse.
Not true, the towers began collapsing from where the planes hit them, and whens something a building falls down one floor, you can bet your ass the floor under it is going to keep from collapsing as well.
Yes your talking of the pancake theory.
The fact it, if each floor was hitting the next and they were falling like that, then why was it falling at free fall speed? Like i said it would have been a lot less smooth. And the rubble left behind would have been huge.
AND, 47 high rise steel beams would have been left standing upright about 200 feet in the air.
Most of the concrete in the building was pulverized by a huge explosion. How would pulverization of that concrete have taken place because of a fire? Its like saying, the car was on fire and then all of a sudden it exploded and was pulverized into nothing but dust.
You know what happens when airplane fuel catches fire inside the fuel tank? Yeah that's right, an explosion occurs.
*If you don't see the nonsense of what you're saying, please reread everything Frigo linked to.
As for the first part where you put so eloquently *no, how can you deny what i said? Its not only truth its fact.
And as for the second part.
Yes my friend, that happened before the building fell. The plane's explosion we saw. It happened. That is not when the concrete was pulverized. That is not when all of that debree flew out over 100 miles an hour away from the building. That is before that. The fact is that the jet fuel had exploded and burned out before the building collapsed. When the building started to collapse all of a sudden all that stuff started flying out of the building. Watch the video of the collapse.
Read the last line of my post.
I have seen it, and I remember what you are referring to, you see, when a floor collapses, there is a lot of air which is compressed, that is what you're calling explosions. It's caused by air pressure blowing holes in the walls(windows most likely) and the black smoke coming out is smoke from the fire inside.
Ok. Even though there is no fire inside ill entertain the idea.
Surely the smoke would have been one puff and would have kept rising.
Smoke rises. Pulverized concrete and debree does not.
And by the way, now that we are talking of air pressure.
If you take a closer look you can see many demolition squibs coming out of the building.
Observe, http://video.google.es/videoplay?docid= ... twin+tower
Yeah, when air pressure blows a hole in the wall, it's not unlikely that some concrete will follow, and not all smoke rises.
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