I am tired of this...

There's been more and more articles appearing on the untrustworthiness of Wikipedia.

 

Yeah, United States is always a special case...
(Aren't written instructions available in Spanish?)

Only they don't take into account the lifetime of incorrect things. Modifying a politician's article is not amongst the undetectable things.

There was an experiment where they compared Wikipedia to Encyclopedia Britannica.

 

Stop all this!
How can we judge another country? Just by those reports made by your own country? Especially when you American government hate Chinese so bitterly, how many of the reports will be trustful?
Blinky, no offence, but I want to ask you how you got to know 'China you have Shang-Hai a mere sixty miles away from people who've never even seen a television'? And what would you think about the report about American we Chinese government had made: 'USA Black people get so many success on sport just because they have no chance to receive education.'
What to trust, and how to? Those are just tricks peformed by the fucking governments, why we must argue for them?
So I'll say it once more, stop all the arguement about countries, it makes no sence.

 

It makes perfect sense MADLAX, and I do stipulate there is alot of misinformation about both countries around the world. Not am I by any implication trying to say America is anything near perfect, I know it's not.

The fact is, China is NOT just going through growing pains. The populated cities in the East like Beijing are as modernized as New York, Boston, or Los Angeles. However, there are peasants, quite close to those metropolitan areas, which have very little hope of progressing past growing rice. EVER.

Of course, you probably don't really hear about them IN China. Given the fact that you obviously have a computer, I'll assume you come from a metropolitan area, and do correct me if I'm wrong. But in a country that outlaws referencing Tiananmen Square on the internet, it's hard to imagine that the Chinese are forthcoming with information about poverty, at least to their own citizens.

Reference: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4695718.stm

At least 50% of the Chinese population is engaged in agriculture. Most of that agriculture is focused on rice, soybeans, yams (I believe, not sure about that one), as well as a few other types of vegetables and starches. These farmers make little or no money. China supplies 20% of the world's food, and yet almost 150 million people in China are undernourished. Factions within China are attempting to rectify this situation, but I have not heard of them having more than marginal success.

I hate to use it, but I got the actual numbers from that off Wikipedia. I have heard numerous estimates from sources I can't refer to now, none of which had actual numbers, but all of which generally coincide with those statistics.

Despite limited aid from the factions referred to above, the Chinese government is really interested in taking care of its peasants. Here is an interesting story about how China is evicting people in the name of the Olympics. I doubt they care much more about their farmers.

Reference: http://cgmg.jour.city.ac.uk/news.php?story=129

Ok, 99% of American media is bullshit. Roughly 100% of Chinese media is propaganda. Both shouldn't be the case. Also, if you're apparently as liberal as you are, why are you so adamantly in support of a government that considers the death penalty a national pasttime. Amnesty International places China as executing at least 10 times the number of people that any other country did in 1999. Those figures are not drastically different now, to my mind, I'm just to lazy to find last year's report by AI. Keep in mind, China does not give strictly accurate reports about these figures, they're estimated to be far higher.

Reference: http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/27/055.html

Why don't you READ my posts. Expect jokingly, I never said anything about Chinese CULTURE. I have serious issues with the Chinese government. Any rational human being who's opened a textbook does.

Also keep in mind, you never said jack about your research. You just said you spent a fortnight there. That would make you a dedicated tourist. Research however, that's slightly more impressive.

I also NEVER said that your country doesn't have the nerve to stand up for itself. I said it would lose. And it would. That is my opinion, based upon all the facts I've seen. Perhaps now, with the American military taxed, China would stand a chance. But toe-to-toe, I do not for a second believe that China could beat the United States. Wars aren't really about manpower anymore. They're about technology, logistics, tactics, and politics. Although America might be lacking clout in the last area, it's my belief that they are superior enough in the other three areas to carry through.

Since we're comparing China and the U.S., I'ld like to point out that it is strictly unfair to compare the State's unemployment rate with China's. No one's holding a gun to American citizen's backs telling us to work.

American education systems do suck, and Bush's policies now aren't helping. That said, they weren't sterling before that anyway, which I readily admit. That's why most intelligent people here educate themselves, as opposed to just assuming things that they hear in biased classrooms are true.

 

I have to agree. However, I'm also a fierce patriot. If I was from China, I would always say how much China lords over the other civilized countries. If I was from Russia, Germany, pretty much any other country, I would always have some reason why my people are better than everyone else. But, I'm an American. Therefore, I think that America is a great place to live. I'll admit, it's a biased point of view, but not any more biased than any of you other patriots see your native lands. One thing that DOES piss me off about America is that there are a bunch of people moving here from other countries and not speaking English. ONe of my friends took Spanish in high school just because 60% of the new American citizens speak Spanish as their first language. He took Spanish, and not German, an infinitely cooler language. You know what I told him? "Why not take German? 100% of all German citizens speak German."
I also hate American high school. Something must be done. Again, all of the non-english speaking students in my classes. People moving to other counties, to live in those other countries, will either learn the native language beforehand, or continue learning it while they live there. Why not in America?

 

Red Army would tear you in 54564534123 pieces if it would hear smth. like this.

 

One does not have to be there to know things about it. I mean, there are experts in ancient Greece, yes? But have they ever BEEN to ancient Greece? No? Didn't think so.

And I still quite agree with Caity; China's an improving country who's recently started to accept a more open economy. They'll be like the US in what? 20-30 years?

And yes, I know this, for I am an expert at Chinese economics right now (I've just finished my schools largest and best graded report on Chinese economics)

 

Ah...college. I wish I was an expert in something. I'll have to settle with being adequately knowledgeable for now.

 

i'm an expert in hating people with other viewpoints.

 

Fuck, now I know who stole my time machine!

 

If you mean the will have the debt that can be compared with one of US, this process will take more time.

 

Sofokl, no other country could defeat the United States in a war. The only way its possible is through guerrilla warfare, and countries don't fight like that. Rebels and insurgents do. Countries have to defend certain areas, making them far less manueverable than guerrilla forces, and thus unable to wage a guerrilla war. That is the only way to defeat the U.S., as of right now anyway.

 

Expect me to invade any moment now...

 

You seem to represent community of 90 million guerrillas.

 

I'm no patriot, and so I simply wish to leave you with this:

fixed quote-tags
/mathboy

 

It's too bad noone in America thinks like that.

 

Of course we are exchanging opnions now, in fact I am not a crazy patriot, not at all. And I'm not surprised to find that Blinky's link is not available for me, it's forbidden by the government.
But just wait and see, now is's a time of changing, everyone has his chance, and of course we have. Now what we are doing seems useless, we educate people and nine tenth of the best students go abroad. We produce things for developed countries and leave the pollution inside our house. We are busy propagating our ancient culture yet unaware of the fact that Japs has controlled the heart of our new generation. But we are bearing, Chinese is a people good at endurance. Though most gifted people are gone still some of them stay (And I will if I prove I am one). Though we suffer from hard labor but most of us have jobs. Though we have no such video games but we are still trying to influence the world's culture. We are gethering power and wait for a chance to raise. And this, fortunately, hasn't been noticed by ANY other country of the world.
No one can foretell the furture, at least I believe it.

 

Oh, it's been noticed. We're fully aware of China's capabilities. I'm not trying to infer China is no threat at all. But in an direct conflict, I still believe the Chinese would lose. Let us also agree that when it comes to war, people on both sides die, hence there really is no winner. Suffice to say China is not as powerful as the United States, and likely won't be for some time.

I would have no qualms at all with a powerful Chinese state, provided that state was not run by butchers, facists, and hypocrites. Unfortunately, at present, that is exactly who runs China. And for that I am sorry for your people, who have done great things, and would again, if only their government didn't deign to get in their way.

 

I just imply that the furture isn't decided yet, just wait and see. Government isn't everything and they are changing themselves. Let both of us just do what a qualified citizen should do, and wait patiently for the result.

And to the end: We are not interested in any form of war, and never will. and there is another thing I'm quite sure of: If America invaded China, you would be defeated, no other answer.


EDIT:Some of the links Blinky made is now available so I read two of them. I've no idea about the executing, but the report on Olympics...I haven't been to Beijing so I don't know what happened there, but I can say something about Shanghai since I live in that city. Here in Shanghai, one of my friends has been subsidized $64,000 because the subway constuction went straight through his house. The prize was about $2600 per square-metre, higher than the macket prize. So the saying of homeless...maybe it's a little too exaggerative, at least in Shanghai.
But something the report mentioned was true, first, you MUST move if your house is in the way. I don't know how you manage it in America, is that means a subway have to change place if you don't want to move? If so, that's really great. Second thing is about Hutong, and that's the saddest of all: in order to modernise, the old culture is spoited. I think we must stop this, but since few people agree with me, (We have so many cultural remains one or two of them is not important at all bah bah bah...) my voice is quite dumb.

 

That's what all big enough developing countries (not african ones, which have 1% chance that they would develop) are trying to do. Hope this chance for such countries will come soon.