Figured someone here might know this

You won't find one that supports Creationism, either. How is that a valid argument?

I don't think we should really throw our opinions on Astrology around if we're just basing it on what we see on Page C7 of the Times. The 12 signs (24 if you start getting into Starsky and Cox's theories) aren't meant to be specifications of each person, but rather very extreme generalizations. It's not trying to say "Everybody born on the 14th of August is a confident leader with a big ego", so much as it's saying "Leos are more prone to have egos". If you cannot tell the difference between the two statements, you need to reconsider your grasp on English. It's forgivable if it is your second language though, since it's a hard difference to communicate effectively.

Also, it's a fun thing to do. You might as well charge into a bunch of kids playing with a Ouija Board and yell "YOU KIDS ARE FUCKING RETARDED WTF IS WRONG WITH YOU GET A LIFE" and see how that goes over.

Things such as the astrological ages and the like actually DO make a lot of sense being used next to Biblical references, seeing as how they share a close bond in history (with Astrology pre-dating Christianity by a couple centuries, but still evolving by the time Jesus started going about). As a matter of fact, it's NOT that wild a coincidence that the beginning of the Piscean Age corresponds with the birth of Christ. I'm actually sort of let down that a group of intellectuals such as this would say something like "Man, astrology is so stupid, charting the stars is for wussies; btw Samson having superstrength due to his manly hair and a mysterious bearded man healing people's disabilities makes sense". Seems like an obvious durrr moment.

I myself believe that science and religion can co-exist. I always figured that, like any art, the artist (in this case God), shaped his creation over time. I don't see why a God can't evolve his creatures, like a divine game of Spore or something. Though, I guess it does screw over the seven days thing.


Xiao: Jesus is going to leave because we treat eachother like shit? What are you talking about, they nailed his wrists to a wooden plank and let him hang there. That's brutal. It's even worse in actual history, since the Romans would simply break your shoulders and sling you over the cross, meaning you would last until your heart stopped, rather than until you bled to death. Usually you'd be there in extreme pain and discomfort for several days. I'm pretty sure Jesus isn't going to be like "Oh shit, corporations push people around in this day and age, life was so much better during the Roman era".

 

I'm not trying to convert anyone on an internet forum, God knows that's a wasted effort. I'm just trying to clear up some misconceptions about the teachings of the bible. Also apparently a wasted effort.

@Grakelin: There are plenty of serious scientists who are either creationists or accept intelligent design as a possibility. Unfortunately, there is a powerful movement these days to silence all opposition to the "scientific consensus". You should watch 'Expelled: No intelligence allowed'

@Garm: Again, I'm not going to pretend to understand how exactly an omniscient omnipotent creator grants free will to his creation, but I can accept that he is able to do so. Again I will point out that God does not always fit within the rigid constraints of mathematical equations. Also, it seems relevant to point out that man does not consist strictly of body and mind, but also of soul. To quote C.S. Lewis, "You don't have a Soul. You are a Soul. You have a body."

 

Fair enough, I guess we were both coming off as kind of arrogant (I know I was). Agree to disagree?

 

Grakelin: Who said I was referring to corporate bullshit? That's minor, small-scale evil compared to the horrible fucked-up things people do to each other in the name of religion. When/If Jesus sees the fucked up shit people do in his name, he'll abandon humanity forever. And you know what?

We'll fucking deserve it too.

 

Inb4pointlessdebate!

...Oh wait, I'm a few days behind. My apologies.

I have nothing to contribute, mainly due to a lack of interest in this topic. I just thought I'd at least provide a little spam. Also, to whomever thought that they could clear up misconceptions about the bible? That's a fail of an idea. Especially on a forum. Particularly THIS forum.

Half of us are die-hard Christians, half are extremist atheists, and the last bunch're uncaring bastards.

 

...And one of us is Charles.

 

Quiet fool! It might come back if you speak its name!

 

Oh, goddamn it. I'll get the candles and the holy water - someone get the enchanted crystals and the leather-wrapped dagger. I need to perform an exorcism to protect us from the horror...

 

Here...*hands over his enchanted crystals and the leather-wrapped dagger* You can use these for the ritual.

 

If Christ assumed the burden of all Christians' sins, then who's going to judge him? Shouldn't he remain in Hell forever?

 

On the subject of angels, I believe the most common (albeit deuterocanonical and so completely ignorable by Protestants) is Thomas Aquinas' thesis.

Angels are perfect. This means that if they are in a state of grace, they cannot sin or fall. Equally, if they are out of grace, they cannot not sin and cannot be free of sin.

In the instant of their creation, they are neither in nor out of grace. In that instant, they choose to fly or fall.

 

I think that only God can judge Christ.

 

Sorry about that, but I think that my internet has acted weird again. Could you remove the double post?

EDIT: Thanks.