Enchanting Items (Reincarnation NOT gravedigging)

Wow. How about you calm down?
I like to argue/debate but random swearing and anger really do nothing to contribute to an argument.

I can take a joke. Your joke was a little condescending so I chose to reply with a joke of my own. You chose to respond to this with anger and swearing.
So who can take a joke?

Yes simplicity is best. Note: Mild humour as indicated by the wink.

As for tech reinforcing natural laws, I think we just have a different idea of what I mean by reinforcing.
Magic is the use of willpower to 'break the law'. Tech makes the law harder to break by 'reinforcing' natural laws (you call it calming).

A nuclear reactor would have a very significant 'calming effect' and would negate most magic, I agree. However even a small fluctuation in the properties of atoms could lead to a disaster as nuclear reactors are inherently dangerous, balanced on the fine line between critical and supercritical. Would you want to be near a nuclear power plant if there was even the remotest chance of a uberdemon strolling past and causing a meltdown?
If a single acolyte can crash a steam train (arcanum flavour stories on the sierra site) I think a powerful mage can screw up a supercomputer.

As for vendigroth:
I have played the game and it quite clearly states that magic in the past had higher levels than it does today. The mages blamed the global weakening of magic on the introduction of tech i.e. the city of wonders. Leading to the (supposed) villain of the game burying the city.
Just 1 city of tech had a global influence on a magical world. So why couldn't a few mages have a global influence on a tech world, effectively reducing the level of tech?
You argue that the highest tech would be most resistant to magic but I offer another view (when talking on the global scale). What if the highest tech (nuclear reactors, etc) are worst effected and lower tech survives more easily in a magical world because the laws it uses are 'simpler' and so less prone to being twisted by magic?
Remember the spells that faded with the rise of tech were not the simplest spells, they were the most powerful spells (equivalent to high tech nuclear reactors). I'm not saying this idea is correct but I put it forward as an interesting theory for discussion.



EDIT:

Blinky:

Official Arcanum FAQ:
http://arcanum.sierra.com/us/game/faq_page01.html

Going to ask them if they read the game manual?

 

No what you did was come in here acting like you own the god damn place you pretentious little noob.

The official Arcanum game says a balanced sword is technological. So what is your argument about it simply being what it is?

In the first part of your post you say that my objection to your diction (reinforcement) was merely a misunderstanding. Then you go on to, in an edit after presumably posting and reading what you wrote, add five quotes, a link, and what you must honestly think is some snappy retort to add a little edge to it. It being a simple miscommunication that you acknowledged yourself. Why don't you just stop trying to be something you're not, namely witty and cute, you're neither. I'm very impressed by your ability to google a few quotes, but not by your alledged arguing/debating skills.

You say you're talking about a global scale, but you're not. "If a powerful demon walks by..." is local scale. And unless that powerful demon, or mage, or acolyte has a greater magic aptitude than the machine has tech, the magic user will be disrupted. And that city of tech presumably was inhabited by more than a few technologists, and even still magic was not disrupted to the point where casting a spell resulted in mass destruction.

Minor fluctuations in the anticipated behavior of atoms happens every day in real life nuclear reactors. While it's not by any means a reaction that can be tinkered with without danger, it's not as sensitive as you'ld think, especially since most modern reactors have stop gauge measures to prevent one or two unanticipated reactions from causing a nuclear meltdown. It takes a considerable percentage of the reaction mass reacting unexpectedly in order to cause an uncontrollable chain reaction without the stop gauge measures kicking in. At least a more considerable percentage than would be caused in such a technologically advanced system by the mere presence of a mage if the reactor were displaced to an Arcanum setting.

You don't have a god damn right in the world to talk about condescending when the first sentence you write in this thread is wrought with some pretentious little snap about HoL's gravedigging policy, and the inferench that by your fourth fucking post, you're qualified to show us the better way of letting people add new life to threads that are dead and buried.

Oh, and I'll curse whenever I feel like it, not because I feel it buoys my argument, but because I don't feel like beating around the bush for the sake of you not liking curse words. I feel like being honest, and I honestly think you're acting like a haughty little bastard, and you need to pull your head out of your fucking ass so you can realize that while you may have bought the game four years ago, you're still not in a position to infer jack shit about forum policies and their effectiveness/ineffectiveness.

You want to pretend to be intelligent and wizened, I don't give a shit, but as a bit of advice the best way to do that atm would be to answer a question if you want to, post an idea if you feel like it. Drop any pretense that you're some particularly witty chap, because you're not, it's obvious you're not, and you just look like a self-important douche. And stop commenting as to procedures on the forum, I'm sure if you PMed DU or Jar with all your particular quarrels with site administration and your arguments for gravedigging they'ld give you the same answer as I'm about to: if you don't like it, go somewhere else.

I'm real sorry for not noting your use of a smiley. Including a semicolon and a close parenthesis is just one of those amazing talents everyone should hone in on, and I must be negligent for not citing it's presence at the end of your clause, hence reversing any connotation the post may have held. Since I didn't include a small face in my post however, you can of course take it at face value. And on that same note, you're an :asshole:

I have to get to bed, but as a closer, if you really don't like swearing, go to fucking GameFaqs and stop bitching here.

 

I shared my opinion, which has already been stated by several people who aren't 'noobs'. Before posting here I read through the archives and some people have been treated rather harshly for necroing a 2 week old thread. This was fresh in my mind when I posted. I also wanted to make clear that my statements were relevant to some older threads in case I was accused of being off topic.

At no point did I say I'm the king of the castle and demand that the mods obey my edicts from on high. If you took offense because you thought this is what I was doing then I apologise for the misunderstanding.

However if you are boiling because a noob has a different opinion to you and dares to voice it, then you can get stuffed because that makes you the arrogant one, not me.

I'm saying in terms of enchanting things (see first post in thread) that balanced swords should be neutral. The process of making a balanced sword may be a tech process but I think that the sword itself should be neutral.
For example, a cotton bailing machine is tech however balls of cotton are not tech. Tech process, neutral product.
Mechanical daggers on the other hand make use of clockwork and stored energy so these should not be enchantable as they are tech.
This is an opinion, as you said this is possibilities for arcanum 2.

I had no proof of my ideas and neither did you. It was an argument that had no end so I decided to take the diplomatic route by saying it was basically the same thing with a different name.
However I was still of the opinion that reinforcing is more appropriate as it implies proactive effect of tech whereas calming implies only that it ''neutralizes latent magickal energy in the air ''. I then found some evidence to back up my idea that tech is proactive so I posted it.
That's a facet of diplomacy, saying ''we are both right but I'm more right than you''. Which I felt justified in saying after I found the proof.

Perhaps I should have waited for your reaction to see whether you agreed (end of discussion) or whether I had to bring out the proof.

I could have deleted the attempt at diplomacy but that seemed a bit underhand.

As for my 'retort', I felt it was very appropriate as you had asked if I had ''completed the goddam game'' and then referred me to the manual. In my defence I have to say that although you criticise my 'wit' the only 'wit' you offer consists solely of obvious sarcasm, calling me cute and swearing. If you showed some real wit I would probably not attempt my own as tangling with the master tends to lead to failure.

Providing proof is an essential debating skill. Personally insulting your opponent is not.
Also you are colouring my words with your imagination. I said I liked a good argument, at no point did I say I had debating skills greater than the next man. Judge me on what I actually say, not what you think I say.

You state that only the less powerful tech / magic object would be affected. That is not true. The most powerful thing would be affected less than the other one but they would both be affected.
So in the demon example: The demon gets a headache, he can hardly breathe, his eyes bleed, etc.
Some electrons in the reactor change energy shells for a few seconds, but this might be enough for a meltdown.
So the demon is affected more but the reactor is also affected.
This is backed up by the link I gave previously. Please note: I am providing evidence to back up my words, no other purpose.

The only mass destruction I referred to was a nuclear meltdown. The nuclear plant caused the destruction, not the magic.
Your comparison of tech and magic is flawed. When magic is affected by tech it fizzles out. The willpower of the mage has to overcome the reinforced laws resulting in less magic being brought into existence so less potential for destruction.
If tech is disrupted by magic there is the possibility for destruction only if the tech contains energy to begin with e.g. nuclear meltdown, steam engine exploding, bullet detonating in chamber of gun, etc. Whereas a clockwork watch has little stored energy so if magic disrupts it it will merely stop.
So a city full of technologists plus a mage = no magic manifestation and perhaps an automaton that trips up but no explosions (unless the mage was next to a boiler and had lots of willpower but it would be the boiler that explodes, not the magic).

Yes and these can be predicted using physics and probability so that reactors can be planned accordingly. Magic adds a truly random factor, rather than the quantum chaos of nuclear reactions which can be predicted with physics. Predictable chaos and true randomness are 2 different things so a reactor could never truly be magic-proof.
As for ''stop gauge measures'', these would also be affected by magic. The boron concentration and / or control rods are operated by machines and computers.

You are combining two separate arguments. Vendigroth/reduction of magic and magic city/reduction of tech was separate to the one about the demon next to the reactor.
Reduction of levels of tech is global, this is to do with my idea.
A demon upsetting a reactor is a local example, nothing to do with my global reduction of tech idea. I gave the demon example just to state that disasters can occur if the tech is inherently unstable to begin with even if the tech is far more powerful than the magic.

I included the smiley for your benefit as you judge everything I say in the worst light possible. It's there to reinforce the fact that I am joking about simplicity so that you wouldn't comment about how wrong I am...but you did anyway. ''Way to take a joke jack ass''

Why do you interpret all I say as arrogance? It's because you know me so well after reading 1 sentence of my first post. You continually call me arrogant but what I find arrogant is judging someone after 1 sentence.

Swearing does not particularly offend me. I was pointing out to you that swearing did nothing to aid your argument and in fact lessened your arguments as they got lost amongst the outbursts. However you agree that swearing doesn't further an argument so we are in agreement.
Also, you have the monopoly on bitching. If you want to call my necro statement bitching then ok, I bitched once. How many times have you bitched, insulting me, when I've been trying to stick to the arcanum argument without getting personal?

I know it is bad netiquette to quote such a large chunk but I think it underlines the fact that you are going overboard on this. All that is in response to 1 sentence, yes 1 single sentence. If it is going to end this then I withdraw my comment from the records. My opinion remains but I will keep it to myself.
However as I said before, other (non-noobs) people have expressed a similar opinion.

Ask DarkUnderlord you say?
You seem to know his opinions, just like you know me.
Well I could ask him or we could just look at this thread where he has made his opinions very clear:

http://www.terra-arcanum.com/phpBB/view ... 5&start=25


Now will you let it drop so we can argue about arcanum rather than you continuously insulting me based on some pretty flawed assumptions?

 

It must be a nice ego-boost to know that your word is invoked as law.
"And lo DarkUnderlord did spake his commandments upon thy masses"

But if I ever want to talk smack about you now I know what to do. Refer to you as ''DorkUnderlard'' and search will pass it by.



Just in case someone is going to accuse me of being cheeky / arrogant, let it be known that I was joking and that I have no reason to talk smack about DarkUnderlord.

 

Oh my...

See! It's because of people like you guys that Arcanum 2 will not be mass-produced!!!

(Nah, just joking)

I think your ideas are cool, TONGS... And I think that Blinky needs a hug *hugs Blinky*, and DarkUnderlord is hot even if you call him DorkUnderlard.

(So now you can pick on me for being a stupid cow and stop bitching about each other!)

 

Yeah, I know... I was sooooo drunk last night... I love you too, Dark Elf!

But anyway, you can't destroy what's dead already... (And I don't smell of dead, thank you very much!)