America says FUCK OFF to the United Nations

oooooohhhhh. so you're saying that when we wanted to start a war and invade a country and destabilize its government in order to protect our foreign interests, (which ultimately amounts to securing luxuries that we, as americans, are entitled to, i.e. the middle east and all of its oil).

so when all of those countries in the UN turned down our proposal for action and condemed any invasion of iraq, and we went ahead and did it anyway, that was them abandoning us? in our time of need no less. of course what was i thinking.

and what exactly did you mean by payback? this wouldnt be us invading them, (which we would never do because their ground isnt spewing crude oil), this would be us using people, whose countries were against the war the minute it was proposed, and told the US that they would have nothing to do with it, as human shields for our boys who we put in danger in the first place. and we would only give the UN troops the honor of being our bullet sponges if they put an american embassador of our choice in charge of these troops.

this is not payback, this is the United States Government finding ways to stop reports coming to us about dead american soldiers, because they think we wont care about dead UN soldiers.

Phoenix you need to realize that there are other news channels than Fox News, and after you discover them you then need to realize that American Journalism is something that needs to be interpreted, as opposed to being taken for face value. this means, keep watching fox news, but also visiting news oriented web sites, listening to National Public Radio, watching c-span, and the newspaper, and just keeping up with current events in general. then come back and argue with an informed opinion.

holding the sons and daughters of another nation in front of ours is not "payback" it is cowardice.[/b]

 

To take a metaphor waaay too far, I'm sort of straddling the fence, one foot on either side, and my hamstrings are REALLY STARTING TO HURT!

I'm too tired to have an opinion (actually, I can't decide between two), but I'm pissed at Bush for sutting $1 bn from the NASA budget...bastard...

 

I'd have to say destabilizing their government was a good thing considering who headed that government.

I don't even watch Fox News. I watch the news on different channels and check in online. I've also read articles from other countries including France. I agree we should have gone to war with Iraq. Now, I don't know what the real reasons were that our government decided to go to war, though I doubt they were as pure as they say nor do I believe it was just over oil. Personally though, I don't care what their reasons were because I do believe that Saddam should have been taken down.

Perhaps they should have helped us when we asked the UN to aid us in the war. Instead of denying us permission to go to war (which btw, the French article said was over oil, but not our profit but the French's having been profiting during the reign of Saddam.) they should have given us permission and troops. No it's not cowardice, it is protecting OUR sons and daughters. But fine, lets just pull out all troops, with no UN forces replacing ours. That seems to be what people think we should do. See how anarchy holds with the Iraqi people. At least until some warlord takes over and is as bad as Saddam or worse.

 

well no shit its what people seem to think we should do, because it IS what we should do! we started it! we should finish it! if you ask your friends to back you up in a fight, and they tell you no, you're an ass hole, and then you punch the guy anywaythe , kick his ass, and stand on his chest, but then suddenly his friends start taking pot shots ask you, why should you expect your friends to suddenly reverse themselves?

this may not be cowardice, but it is greed. do you think we would have backed the french if they had been suffering economically during saddam's reign? and we had been profiting? NO!

you seem to have a fucked up sense of logic.

 

Well, we've been helping other countries for most of our history and gotten nothing out of it so actually we might have.

 

good point. one should help anyone else other than for their onwn personal profit. now i can see why you agree with the invasion of ira

 

i am speachless...

that




is






so








awesome.

 

Let's see, 10 Americans wounded or killed each & every day scince Bush, in what is certainly not his last lie, said the hostilities were over. And the Cowardly French & Germans seem to think that being our meat shields is not a fulfulling role.

Well, as long as there is still go juce for your SUV, I suppose that the war was justified. You can simply forget about the dead & injured when you fill your tank.

But I thought that the gas was supposed to get cheaper once we owned Iraq. No matter, on to Iran, there is a pretender in LA who insists his people will welcome us with open arms & flowers. And they might have a nuclear program.

Phoenix, what law, American or otherwise, lets us invade anyone we want to? No matter how much they deserve it. When the Japs did it to us, we called it a war crime & hung a batch of them for it.

 

We might be the international police, but even the cops need warrants. And if the judge (the UN) doesn't feel there is sufficient evidence to issue a warrant, than the cops cannot act upon themselves. And even if the UN IS a hopelessly ridiculous institution that should be put down, we are still a part of it. If we are going to be in it, and say that we support it, thn we have to listen to what they say. If we leave it, then we wouldn't be putting out any pretences about following their law, but while we belong, we should listen to what they say. And honestly dudes, if we can't get sufficient evidence that saddam hussein is an asshole, our accusations might be a little off.

 

the patriot act :lol:

it wasnt unwaranted necessarily, the iraqi people needed freedom, but i dont know if they needed it yet. they still cut peoples hands off for stealing etc.

 

Quote:
We might be the international police

Er, excuse me, but I have this question... just who declared you to be the international police (apart from yourselves I mean)? Having power doesn't mean that you're right, and it certainly doesn't give you the right to do as you please.

 

Okay let us think about this for a second.

The US cannot simply pull out of iraq, since it would maybe lead to another dictator like saddam or maybe more likely another islam state like iraq.

Neither is in the intrest of either the US or Europe.

Now tthere is no doubt that the US has fucked upp over there, apperantly there was supposed to be free elections about now, that is atleast what they said before the war. The soldiers over there is unable to stop attacks against the water supply in many citys, mostly because they are too bussy to hide behind their own barbed wire.(a qoute i took from a norwegian aider who was down there). This again creates more anger in the population. People over there cannot even get gasoline a decent prices anymore.

SO the US goes and askes the world for help. Interesting to see how the us oppinion has changed from "we are currently thinking about weather we should punish those that do not support us in this war" at the end of the war, to "please help us, we cannot manage this ourselves" As in one of the presvious examples: your friend decides to beat the shit out of a guy, you do not wish to aid him so you let himi go ahead and do it himself and while he is winning he yells to you, " you are going to be punished for not helping me". And this friend is the big guy in the school yard, and he is rich and you know he can get to you in many ways, but when he is holding the kid down, the kid starts using dirty tricks against him, so he yells to you "hey can you help me"

Why should we help you when you were talking about punishing uss finanscaly?

Might does not give people right retard, That is the short answer to why you would never invade Kuwait. I can elobarate if you would like me to.

But now i will play TP cya all.

 

Judical Watch, a right wing watchdog orgizanation, has found out that during Dick Cheny's secret energy policy meeting back in the dawn of this horrid administration, maps of Iraq, & coppies of contracts they had signed with France & Russia, were used as "brefing tools".

We did not invade Iraq to let them have free elections. We did not invade Iraq to let them decide to whom they would sell their state industries, nor for how much. We invaded Iraq to make Boy George's wealthy friends even richer.

And don't mind Retard. He remains willfuly ignorant. And to people like him, not only does might equal right, if you have it & don't use it, you are a fool.

 

thats pretty funny that people believe our president if he said that we should expect them to be having free elections by now. if he did say that then he was just blatantly lying, or hes a complete fucking idiot. we were in japan for 12 years after world war 2, helping rebuild their government. and look at iraq, do you think, after such a long period of oppression, that there are any worthy political minds in that country that rent lying in the skull of a corpse because of saddam? i'm sure that the years they spent under his rule have pretty much cancelled out any political thoughts other than fantasies of complete anarchy like that which took place immediately after the war.
as for how right the war was or not, its been petty hard for me to make up my mind. it really depends on the policies we put in place after we leave, and these could be completely affected by the next president we have. so i think that now more than ever we should be pushing for a much more liberal president (as in a green party candidate, not republican or democrat) then we could really do the iraqi people some good. but if we keep corporate cock suckers like bush in the head office, then i dont think the iraqis can have much good to look forward to other than a possibly less ruthless regime. maybe theyll change the laws so they only pebble you to death if you cheat on your wife, or cut your fingernails if you're caught stealing.

 

a)All prospective world leaders should do an intelligence test .
b)Dynasties should not be allowed. If your daddy was pres you cannot be.
c) Rich kids that were fed with golden spoons should not be able to run.
It would be ok and desirable however if the leader had made his/her fortune him/hershelf.

 

while i understand why you said this, i dont know if any of that is really the greatest idea.

if we had A) in place then we'd be discriminating against other people, and starting an elitist system based on education (even more so than the one we have today), which may not be available to others, and despite their lack of education, colleges would completely cash in on this as well. Also if you had to take an intelligence test to be president, why not other jobs? it could start a bad trend, and you know that a system like this would be corrupted almost instantly. we'd be posting answers right now.
B) i dont think thats right, while you shoudlnt be president solely because of your fath, you also should not NOT be president for the same reason. this goes for C) as well. just because your daddy was rich doesnt mean you couldnt do a good job, and it doesnt make you better or worse than anyone else. does anyone think that because i am american that i am a right wing leg humping fascist ass hole? i'd like to think that people are inclined to give other people a chance "based on the content of their character" as Martin Luther King jr. said.

 

Silvara read the rest of my post, not just the first line dude. We are clearly the strongest country on Earth, and it is a common republican argument that, because we are the strongest, we must be the police for the rest of the world. On that argument my post is hinged.

 

I think we can all agree that American power is being misused by the powers that be and that the world would be a better place if those same powers weren't such self-serving bastards who were focused solely on lining their own pockets. It is an aberration of humankind that we permit such foolish things to continue.

 

Speak for yourself. :roll: