US Attack

If you've seen the news at all you've seen that the World trade center is gone.... Both towers were destroyed when an air plane crashed into each one. After a while they both totally collapsed

 

Is there really a single person who missed it? A terrible hting has happened and let's just hope that people directly responsible for it will be caught and brought to justice.

One question. Some hijacked planes (two I think) crashed down in uninhabited areas away from cities. Anyone knows whether terrorists crashed these or were they shot down due to safety precautions. I heard such a news on TV but cannot find confirmation.

 

As to the two other planes, the first crashed into one end of the pentagon, and the other crashed somewhere outside of pittsburg, and appeared to be on its way to camp david.

 

the people responsible brought to justice?
I tell you that is just what the terrorysts were thinking they were doing. To them US is the greatest snake that needs it's head cut off. I'm sorry for anyone american really. This is really a true tragedy. I'm a history junkie plannig to be a diplomat. And the truth is The US had this coming for a long time. They do not teach in schools that the first terrorists were Jews and the first terrorist training facilities were american.
I'm not anti American This is just a handful of facts brought to you by someone who is a lesser Historian. I'm just scared about retaliataion it's scary. I really don't want another World War or something.

 

Oh, Jinxed, did you open a can o' worms.

I'm a history junkie too. Got a degree in it, after all. First terrorists were Jews? During their attempt to establish a homeland in Palestine, some Jews did resort to terrorist acts. The first terrorist camps American? Do you mean gov't sanctioned or private? I cannot find any info to substantiate US gov't involvement, so if you could point them out to me....and I mean books or jounals or respectable internet sites, please.

By the way, "terrorists" have been around a lot longer than the US has been around. One can argue (and many have) that the US rebels were terrorists when we rebelled against England. All depends on your point-of-view.

As to the US had it coming to it, that is a deplorable and insensitive statement, no matter what your protestations are.

Is that the feeling of most people outside the US? That we deserved it? That makes no sense to me. We are not perfect, nor do we claim to be. Many nations love to criticize us, but to what nation do most immigrants go? Makes you wonder why, if we deserve the hate and violence of the world, do people try to come and live the American dream?

 

I know that two that hit WTC buildings and the one that hit Pentagon. I was wandering what caused the last crash(es) - their 100% sure number was unknown for some time. According to the latest news four were hijacked in total and the last one of them crashed in some forest. So was it shot down or did terrorists just decide to smash it on the ground?

I know but it's a little different, don't you think? Bringing someone to justice for a real crime should not be compared to bringing someone to justice cause he's evil in a fanatic's eyes (even though some of US actions are controversial at best).Besides killing innocent people hardly can be called justice.

It's true, especially with US officials' approach to the middle east question. Not even a single word of criticism towards Israel's retaliation actions against Palestinians. Especially that those are attacks mostly on civilians and Palestinian legitimate government. (which is pretty stupid cause Israel accuses Palestinian officials of doing nothing to fight terrorism yet intead of helping them they shoot at them)

After such an attack doing nothing because of fear of retaliation's consequences is not an option. This would cause the terrosrists to be even more daring with their next attack. However it must not be a full scale retaliation even against those not directly responsible. This would be just about the most stupid thing to do. For example if it occured that one of Palestinian terrorist groups is responsible US must not aid Israel even more or, worse even, join Israel directly in fighting the whole of Palestine. Instead aiding Palestinian officials in fighting these terrorists groups would be a much better thing to do. [I know that the person responsible is most probably Usama Bin Laden, I used Palestinians as they fit my example better].

I didn't know about Jews but I heard about those terrorist trainiing facilities. Could you write something more or point me to some source where I might read about it?

 

Really, I am not anti American. I swear. If I could I would try my luck at the american pie. But things like the abombs dropped at the Japaneese are not my choice of "pie". I'm not blaming the American people for anything it's the people at power my friend. What happend to the native Americns? What happened to the Buffalos? How many people died in the Civil War? Did the Afro American Society really receive benefits after the War? These questions can only be answered truelly by a History Junkie
In response to your questions Yes the Jews who terrorised the Brits For their homeland.
And I cannot point out the sources 'cause they are sources from my Native Polish Great Library. And I don't think for example the Japaneese are spotless in History. Think of their Camps on witch they conducted human experiments and killed alot of people. But they admit it they don't hide it. "America is a Nation Witch justifies every crime in the name of patritism" - An exert from Spriggan. But on the margin every nation has alot things to hide. We could talk for hours about all the nasty stuff in history but what's the point? We are talking about the Crashes

_________________
The Real Anime Otaku
Morning Musume
Aikawa Nanase
Don't be Baka
Arigato!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Jinxed on 2001-09-11 22:11 ]</font>

 

Having something coming to you does not mean you deserve it. It's just a consequence of US' actions. Believe me that most people around the world sympathise with US (my opinion at least), however for people outside US it's also easier to see how US' specific attitude in cases like Middle East conflict and, related to it, the late conference about human rights can provoke such attacks.

 

I can't I'm sorry, The americans sent people just as they did in Vietnam as consultants but they builts facilities to train Arab freedom figters at that time to have them fight soviet related incidents.

 

how about the human rights? The Us were the nation that didn't even sing the aoutlawing of shotguns in real battle (being shot with it isn't so hot, espcially if you survive and receive no help) among other things that they did not sign. How about the latest?
I think some Scandinavian Countries accused the Jews of being racist towards The Palestinians And the Jews and US just left the conference. It was a prtty good sign about what they had to say

 

american ppl should blame the goverment for making so many enemies in so many little countries.......

 

The reason the US and Israel left the Racial Conference is that the Arab nations were trying to put in language that equated Zionism with racism. Zionism is the belief that Jews should have a homeland in Israel. We've walked out of this sort of thing before, and the UN recently rescinded a resolution condemning Zionism.

Notice that in that conference such things were ignored such as the caste system in India, European attitudes towards guest workers, the Talibans treatment of its people. Nope, much more fashionable to bash the US.

Actually, here in the US we are pretty open about our history. And it is taught, even though often in a biased light. We do recognize the fact that we weren't always the most honorable in our dealings, and were often treacherous bastards.

Oh, by the way, the Japanese government may admit (very reluctanctly) that it did a few bad things in WW2, but that is NOT taught in Japanese schools. Their official textbooks treat these things as if they never happened. In fact, Japanese scholars who insist that the government did commit many atrocities including the Rape of Nanking (there is a book by that name, I suggest it as a good indication of what the Japanese military was capable of) are labelled as treasonous by their colleagues.

Actually, the US government has criticized Israel about its policies of retaliation. I actually saw the headlines. I guess it all depends on what the news of your area reports.

Personally, I think the Palestinians have got it all wrong. They should try the tactics of Gandhi and Martin Luther King, Jr., and use non-violence. All violence does is perpetuate the hatred. And have you noticed how none of the suicide bombers are the leaders of the various organizations?

American civil rights is on-going. But it has improved. Civil rights leaders now fight against racial profiling, whereas only 40 years ago they were fighting for their lives. We've got a long way to go, but we've come a long way, too.

Okay, okay, I'll get off my soap box now. :roll: Sorry about that. I just get aggravated when I see so much blame laid at the feet of the US.

Jinxed, do you mean there are no English translations of those sources? I've got the Texas A&M library nearby, and they have access to a lot of good historical information. If you could give me some translated titles, it would give me a place to start researching. Yep, I'm a history geek, and I actually enjoy doing that sort of thing. I'd appreciate it.

 

My condolances to anyone who has lost friends or family to this :sad:

 

_________________



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Acacia22 on 2001-09-13 02:09 ]</font>

 

Wookie: Okay I might give you something but later since I don't remember them now.
look people, and you 2 wookie, The US long time ago gave aid to The Jews, making at the same time long time enemies with the arabs, I've lived in Syria for 5 years Wookie should know what country I'm talking about since it's kinda intering piece of history.
Now Islam is a different kind of religion, it's very how should I say telling you how do be and who to kill" All non Islams are dogs that will be ruled after Isalm takes over the world. This is a religion. Now US Helped The Jews 'cause of a place in Polish "zloty Szlak" In inglish Golden Route
there is a river in that area that is an excellent trade route The problem now in Izrael is WATER there is no water anywhere except the river. The fruits or Izreal are worth GOLD they grow them but irrigation is virtually impossible The arabs once even dug a hole to take the water and waht happened war!
The US is really tired of the War it wants to quit for a long time now, But every time it tells the Jews that they are on their own, there are some shootings, telling US that they need more cash beacuse the arabs will win. That is what I know. Jews are very much funded by the US. And the arabs know this and that is why they hate the US so much. How much weapons has the US sold to Izrael? Us made alot of money on the war really. And YOU WOOKIE where did you get YOUR info about what they teach and don't in Japan??? You know youreself that history tought in schools is mostly based on their political views! Depends on your political view, what you teach. It's like that since politics started. I have been studing In a very well knowm american School the official American School, And I tell you that Americans were the first were the first to do a "drive by shooting" from trains on Buffaloes. Thay did not teach me that in school. And they teach you in Us schools the ways of seeking information. You get info youreself and most americans (no offence)
are busy doing something else. You name it.

 

i'm been to several "forums".. and u guys is the first sensible one that talk about this issue.. i agree with some of what jinxed said, we do have some contradictions & inconsistencies when it comes to the middle east.. however, just wanna remind myself and everyone that there is no proof that this is an act from the middle east.. till then, it's better not to speculate anything.. i'm interested in what the president has to say tonight..

 

Generally what I want to also say is that. Yes there is no excuse for terrorism, I know That the UNA Bomber Was Polish, (burn in hell TEd) But the bombings in US were something that they laid upon themselves.
I know that they did not set bombs and crash the plane onto themselves but IT WAS THEIR ACTIONS THAT LED TO THIS. There is always a price to pay for being a superpower. It is just sad to see that always the innocent people who pay, the price is the greatest
_________________
The Real Anime Otaku
Morning Musume
Aikawa Nanase
Don't be Baka
Arigato!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Jinxed on 2001-09-12 00:40 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Jinxed on 2001-09-12 03:14 ]</font>

 

First off, look at the thousands of lives that have been heinously extinguished this morning. For the time being, can people not respect those unfortunate people that are worried and grieve over lost loved ones? This debate, if one can call it that, over responsibility and such should not be ignored, but is this really the time to be discussing it?

 

Jinxed, i dont agree on what you said about Islam.. i have many muslim friends and they certainly don't have that kinda mentality.. they are as peaceful as any other religion advocates.. what i can say is, whoever is behind this, is a pure maniac that doesnt deserve any association with a religion expect the devil!!

damn, it's much easier as far as religion in arcanum..

 

I know and I agree and I'm also sorry.
But if anyone has something to say, free your mind