SPOILERS: uses of persuasion and Charisma

Discussion in 'Arcanum Hints & Tips' started by jfkoski, Oct 27, 2007.

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  1. jfkoski

    jfkoski New Member

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    WARNING: The following may be considered spoilers.

    IMHO:
    Charisma should be for followers, and reaction modifiers (as in changing a "bad reaction").
    Persuasion should be for convincing people to give/take something, or tell/believe something.
    Haggle should be to negotiate a better price.
    Haggle Expert training allows you to sell stuff to npc's that they normally don't want to buy.
    Haggle Master training allows you to buy stuff from npc's that they don't normally want to sell.
    In practice, persuasion and/or charisma are sometimes used in place of haggle for dropping/raising the price and its training abilities (above). I think these would be errors.

    I went through the dialog files searching for where this skill and stat turn up. I hate the word, "perha-ps". I also kept an eye out for high IN dialogs like {12}, and sometimes wrote down haggle skills too. I know of one script that tests for persuasion, but haven't gone through them all to look. Persuasion and haggle have their own letter codes, ps and ha, while others like melee use the default: sk2. When two or more levels are tested for in dialog I've marked them like so: ps 4 8 12

    Charisma CH
    Intelligence IN
    Perception PE
    Persuasion ps, (sk 11)
    haggle ha, (sk 9)
    Training level, tr11 1(apprentice) 2(expert) 3(master)
    Character Points to skill level: 1cp=4, 2cp=8, 3cp=12, 4cp=16, 5cp=20
    tech aptitude ta
    mage aptitude ma

    SHROUDED HILLS
    ==============
    Constable Owens, bad reaction: CH 9
    Jongle, apprentice training (ps 1)
    Lukan, ps 4
    Ristezze, ps 4; ha 4 5
    Sogg, CH 9; p.o.'d: CH 20

    Molochean "brother"; ha ? (Bug-Fix-Patch addresses haggle error).

    DERNHOLM
    ========
    Archibald, ps 4 8
    Garrick, melee training first: ps 12 (error: idiot has, ps -11)
    Jayna, bad reaction: CH 11; p.o.'d: CH 20; ta 10
    Praetor, ps 8 (error: should be haggle, ha 8); irrelevant dialog options: CH 13, CH 15, ta 30, ma 30
    Vollinger, bad reaction: CH 15; p.o.'d: CH 20

    BLACK ROOT
    ==========
    Clarissa, throw training first: ps 12
    D'ak Taan, irrelevant dialog: CH 15
    Dante, ps 10 13; CH 13
    Franklin, bad reaction: CH 15; irrelevant dialog CH 17; p.o.'d CH 20
    Garret, (error: should be haggle) $140-150: regular; $80: CH 7 to 10; $50 CH 11 to 14;
    free: CH 15 or na -50 (i.e. negative alignment less than or equal to -5)
    Mayor, ps 8; CH 13 (errors? dialog options get same results); bad reaction: CH 10
    Tailor, apprentice training (ps 1)
    Ticket Agent, skip speech: ps 15

    Grunwalde, ha 10, ha 15 (error: if haggle 7-9)
    Mrs. Cameron, hat: ta 2; dagger: ta -1
    Shipbuilder, $35,000: ha 20; $25,000: tr9 3 (master haggle)

    ASHBURY
    =======
    Conductor-mage, ps 8 ma -40
    Conductor, ps 10 ma-10
    Geoffrey, p.o.'d: CH 20
    Kendrick, bad reaction: CH 15
    Mayor, ps 4
    Phineas, bad reaction: CH 9
    Raymond, apprentice training (ps 1)
    Tailor, apprentice training (ps 1)
    Theodore, bad reaction: CH 10; $200-250; $300-350: ha 4; $400: ha 8
    Ticket Agent, skip speech: ps 15
    Town Hall Meeting, ch 13 15; ra 1 (dwarf); IN 10 11 12 13 14 15; ma -25; ta 10 25; (error: w/quotation?)
    OK: 11-14 points, Excellent: 15+ points

    TARANT
    ======
    Ale Wharehouse Guard, ps 12
    Alice, apprentice training (ps 1)
    Babcock, ps 12
    Benjamin Gershwin, ps 4
    Boil Lurker, CH 13 14 15
    Captain Wheeler, bad reaction: CH 15; rp 1025 (Butcher of Stillwater); sk14 15 (pick lock)
    Cassandra Pettibone, bad reaction: CH 8 12; ps 4 13 15 (error: should be haggle); ha 12 13 14
    Cedric Appleby, CH 13; bad reaction: CH 12; ha 11
    Charles Dunston, bad reaction: CH 12; ha 4 8
    Chukka, p.o.'d CH 17
    Conductor, ps 10
    Conductor-mage, ps 8 18 (error: should be -17 not -14)
    Damian Maug, CH 15; ps 12; ha 15
    Dr. Tristan Fenwick, bad reaction: CH 14
    Edward Willoughsby, CH 8; master training: ps 20 + tr11 2
    Evelyn Garringsburg, CH 12
    Factory Guard - Bates, bad reaction: CH 10
    Frederick Fitzgerald, spot training first: ps 12
    James Kingsford, ps 4
    Jared, bad reaction: CH 10; na-200
    Gar: ps 8; p.o.'d CH 17
    Gate Guard, ps 4
    Gilbert Bates, ps 12 15 (error: should be haggle); Chukka available: CH 12
    Gurin Rockhollow, bad reaction: CH 9; PE 15 (perception)
    H.T. Parnell, ps 8; CH 12; ha 12 13 14 15 16
    Joseph Stonecutter, irrelevant reaction: CH 10
    Larrs, bad reaction: CH 15
    Laura, ps 4 6; CH 9; sk9 6 (haggle)
    Librarian, ha 14; bad reaction: ch 13; insult recovery: CH 19; idiot: ps 14 (error: should be haggle)
    Madam Lil, expert training (ps 9, tr11 1)
    Magnus Shale Fist, CH 10; p.o.'d: CH 20; joins Torian Kel: CH 20
    Milo, bad reaction: CH 15
    Miranda Tears, irrelevant dialog: CH 15
    Mr. Plough, irrelevant reaction: CH 10
    Poone (flophouse), ha 7
    Perriman Smythe, bad reaction: CH 15; p.o.'d: CH 20; joins Geoffrey: CH 20 (needs fix)
    Professor Aldous Buxington: bad reaction: CH 15
    Polluck, CH 15; ha 10 14 15
    Sammie White, irrelevant dialog: ps 15
    Sebastian, ps 12; bad reaction: CH 15; p.o.'d: CH 20
    Stanton, ps 4; bad reaction: CH 10
    Telegraph Officer, bad reaction->free: CH 12
    Tailor, expert training:
    Thaddeus Mynor, CH 15; bad reaction: CH 16; ha 12 13 14 15 17 18 19
    Ticket Agent, ps 15; ha 12
    villager, bad reaction: CH 13; ma 20; ta 20
    Wendell Wellington, ps 4; bad reaction: CH 10

    W.Thomas, $75,000: ha 20; $50,000: tr9 3 (master haggle)

    ISLE OF DESPAIR
    ===============
    Inner Guard, ps 8
    Maximillian, bad dialog recovery: CH 15
    Ogdin, ps 4 8
    Outer Guard, bad reaction: CH 15
    Thorvald, (idiot: ps 4 15); ps 5 9; ha 5 9 13; st 15; join: ps 9 ra-5 (PC not gnome)

    WHEEL CLAN
    ==========
    King Loghaire, p.o.'d: CH 20
    Randver, secret passage: ps 8 + PE 8 (perception); philosophy IN 10 (6)
    Vegard, duplicate info: ps 20

    STILLWATER
    ==========
    Brigitte, (boo-tay); irrelevant dialog: ps-13 + ra7 (orc)
    Innkeeper, bad reaction: CH 11
    Marley, ps 8 + IN 10
    Myrth, (unpersuadable re: Qintarra); ps 8 13; CH 10 14 15 19.
    Richard Leeks, irrelevant: CH 16
    Stanley Hippington, bad reaction: CH 15; irrelevant dialog: CH 10

    QINTARRA
    ========
    Fawn, reaction: CH 12; not-good heal training: ps 16
    Guard of Jormund, ps 8
    Ivory, ps 8; IN 13 (bonus exp); CH 14; bad reaction: CH 14
    Jormund, IN 12 14; bad reaction: CH 14; irrelevant dialog: IN 11 CH 15
    Raven, bad reaction: CH 16; p.o.'d CH 20; joins Z'an Al'urin: CH 20; male + IN 5 + human/elf/halfelf + BE 10 (lovey-dovey)
    Swyft, bad reaction: CH 14

    CALADON
    =======
    Adam Maxwell, CH 12 (error: should be haggle)
    Bingham, CH 15; ra2 (dwarf); ha 14 15 16 17
    Chief Inspector Henderson, bad Reaction CH 16; IN 10 + CH 10; CH 13; IN 10
    Farad, PE 13; CH 10 14 15; ps 12; ha 10 15
    Hadrian, ps 16
    James Legget, bad reaction: CH 10
    Lillian Misk, CH 18 (boo-tay); ha 7 11 15
    Maxim, bad reaction: CH 15; IN 15
    Sam Longwell, bad reaction: CH 10
    Telegraph Operator, CH 14

    Negotiations:
    -------------
    Advisors to King, CH 19 (4 points ea. for good U.K. dialog options: ALL railroads, technological age, Bates genius, dismantle troops, the heavier the tax, immediate change, free shipping, labor unions outlawed, seniority prevails, share EVERYTHING)
    ......CALADON ACCEPTS: (Caladon points >22)
    bribery agriculture, anyone
    bribery exporter, anyone (I added boo-tay reward)
    bribery labor, anyone
    bribery mage, ma 41
    bribery military, bow+dodge+melee+throwing >20
    bribery mint, anyone
    bribery parliament, anyone
    bribery techie, ta 41
    bribery treasury, (script nulls dialog for bribe; otherwise would be: ha 16)
    Edward Willoughsby, preposterous failure (U.K. points <1 not possible), disappointing $3000 (U.K. points below 26 ), $7000 + master training (U.K. points 26-37), $11,000 + master training + reputation (U.K. points more than 37 )

    ROSEBOROUGH
    ===========
    Frederik, bad reaction: CH 12, sk2 12 (melee)
    Guard Captain, bad reaction: CH 10
    Trevor Lynwood, ps 12 (error: should be haggle)

    T'SEN-ANG
    =========
    Min Gorad, ps 12; IN 12; CH 15 + IN 10; CH 15 + IN 14; CH 16 + elf (boo-tay); CH 17 + elf (boo-tay); CH 19
    Villager, bad reaction: CH 10
    Z'an Al'urin, bad reaction: CH 15; p.o.'d: CH 20; Raven: CH 20

    TULLA
    =====
    Albert, suceess: ps 15; fails: ps12 + ps-14 + ta 50; ps 16 (error: can't get to with ps 16 to use)
    Herzod Munk, bad reaction: CH 17
    S'Btin'ka, [IN 5] $0: gf2421 (mastery of morph); $500: ma 30 + sc9 2 (know 2+ morph spells); $1000: sc9 2 or ha9; [IN-4] (idiot) $1000: ha 9; else $2000.

    AT LARGE
    ========
    Arbalah, bad reaction: CH 10
    Bounty Hunter, ps 9
    city store, apprentice training (ps 1)
    Edwin Wallows, bad reaction: CH 16
    Fahrkus, ps 4; sk2 4 (melee)
    Inn Keeper, ha 7; bad reaction: CH 11
    Jyheirad, ps 12
    Molocheans, ps 9
    Orc Bandits, Race: half-orc
    Pub Patrons, ps 8
    Ship Captain, ha 12
    Torian Kel, p.o.'d CH 18
    William Bench, ps 8

    VOID
    ====
    Arronax's Guard, ps 16
    Arronax-Kerghan conversation, ps20 + CH20
    Bane, CH 15 17 19; sk2 18 (melee); CH 15 + ma 60
    Kerghan, ps20 + CH20 + (device OR falchion)
     
  2. jfkoski

    jfkoski New Member

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    I left out a very important one:

    Kan Kerai, ps 12
     
  3. jfkoski

    jfkoski New Member

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    Found another important one:

    Marley, ps 8 + IN 10
     
  4. TimothyXL

    TimothyXL New Member

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    Nice to know, makes the game quite a bit more interesting (and levelling strategy planning can now be taken a bit further).
     
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