I would like your guys's opinon

Im doing a research paper for my English class and I would like some feedback. My topic is Teenager Rights. Do you think teenagers should have the same rights as an adult?? Yes or no, if no, what rights do you think they should have??

 

Well, if there werent no differences between teens and adults there wouldn`t be any teens now would there?

Seriously: no! Teens are irresponsible hormosick idiots who don`t have any real threat of imminent consequenses to their actions.

Besides; being an adult must really suck, so I for one don`t plan on growing up anytime soon!

Put that in your paper!

- Zen

 

Some things that might affect my opinion:

• What age range do you consider "teenager to be?" Is it:
  • Literal: 13-19 years old
  • Puberty: somewhere between 10-18 yrs old
  • Adolesence: somewhere between 10-25 yrs old
• How do you define "rights?" Is it:
  • Inalienable human rights, such as the right to life and the right to freedom.
  • Legal rights, defining the liberties, restrictions and methods of protection associated with an individual through act of law.
  • Coventional/social privileges, representing the behaviour society considers acceptable or unacceptable from teenagers.

If we can assume answers (a) and (b), above, I'd say that teenagers should have different rights from adults, for several reasons.

As Zen said, physiological changes that happen during the teenage years have a big impact on the way we think. We could say that this makes it hard for teenagers to "think clearly" sometimes, and they (and the rest of society) need to be protected against the more extreme behavioural outcomes that can occur at those times.

Also, the human family unit protects teenagers from responsibility. Not having responsibility will also affect behaviour, and the law needs to recognise this. For instance, an adult is held responsible for his or her own debts, whereas a parent may take responsibility for the debts of a teenager. Clearly, adults have more incentive to treat debts seriously, and this should be recognised when determining the legal rights of a person to be given a loan.

Anyway, I'm sure there are other arguments, both for and against. These ones are just the way I see it. Thanks for the post, by the way. It's a very interesting subject.

 

By Teenager I mean 13 to 18. And by rights I mean (A)(B)and(C).

This is also very personal to me because I am 15 years old and I have had my rights stepped on more times than I can count.

 

I can see where you're coming from, Yeayea. As an adult, I naturally spent the normal amount of time as a teenager.

I know it seems that adults are always claiming they know what is best and younger people get treated like second-class citizens.

I also know that almost everyone I meet has an egocentric view of the world, whereby - at any given time - people older than them or younger than them are somehow doing things wrong. I'm amazed at some of the complaints people in their early twenties level at teenagers, who are merely doing exactly the same things the complainer did a few years back.

Although not about teenagers, one example always makes me chuckle. When we (my brothers and I) were kids (<13), we used to play football (soccer) in the street. We were forever bumping cars with our ball and kicking it into gardens, etc. We even smashed a few windows. We used to have names for the people who complained. The two we hated most were "Twaitsey" and "Moany Mick," who used to shout out stuff from their windows, like "If that ball comes in my garden again, I'll stick a knife through it!"

Then, a few years ago, my younger brother and I were sitting in my mum's house, where we'd grown up. Some kids were playing football in the street, and the ball came into our garden a couple of times and bumped the wall. My brother (around 20 at that time), moved over and started peering out of the window, muttering. I was silently smiling to myseld at what an old bastard he seemed to be. Then, the next time the ball came in our garden, he knocked on the window and made grumbling noises at the kids who came to retrieve their ball.

I couldn't believe how quickly he had gone from being one of the kids kicking the ball to one of the people complaining about it. The thing that amazed me most was the way he didn't find the changeover strange. It was like he had no memory of being like those kids. When I asked him about it he said something like "We were never that bad. Those kids just take the piss." I knew for a fact that we had been WORSE. We were right little buggers.

People do this kind of thing all the time. They put people in little groups, and then complain about the groups that they're not members of. Adults complain about teenagers and old people. Teenagers complain about old people and adults. Old people complain about everyone younger than them. A lot of the time, people are complaining about stuff that they would do in the same position.

In defense of adults (my group) when dealing with teenagers, it's worth considering that some adults may empathise with teenagers, even when they appear to be restricting their liberties. After, every adult had been a teenager and thereore knows something about what being a teenager is about. Teenagers, on the other hand have never been adults, and so may find it more difficult to empathise with adult motivations.

The truth is, I also have my "rights stepped on," even though I am an adult. I can't do just as I would like to. I have to work 8 hours a day. I have to give away some of my hard-earned cash to people I have never met. I have to pay rent. I have to cook my own food. I have to keep my house clean or live in a dirty house. I can't just go where I like, when I like, since I ether don't have the money, time or right to enter a building/place.

The fact is, the LAW says I can pretty much do what I want (within reason), and I hae nobody, such as parents, telling me otherwise. However, the demands of taking care of myself very much restrict what I am able to do. As a teenager, I was able to spend as much as 6 hours (or maybe more) playing computer games an evening, if I chose to do so. As an adult, I'm lucky if I can get to play at all quite often.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sheriff Fatman on 2002-02-07 22:05 ]</font>

 

I mean rights like my personal rights. The right to freedom of speech, of press, of privacy. Teenagers are treated like blacks were in the 1800's. We get glared at if we are in a store alone, sneered at when we ask for help, ignored if we try to talk to our own school board. The teachers treat us like we are stupid. The only time administration talks to us is to tell us that we are in trouble. Our parents tell us to sacrafice our friends for grades. Like my poor friend, she was getting poor grades because, I dont mean to be offensive, she is just, a slow learner. Her father was yelling at her and hitting her because of it, her boyfriend and her were madly in love and she became pregnant, her father beat her unconsious and threw her out of the house. She went back in tears because it was cold and he took her in and then raped her in the middle of the night. She stabbed him with a pair of sissors in self defense. She is now in juvinile hall because her father said that he had done nothing and the attack was unprovoked. Her boyfriend too was arrested because they were both only 15.

Just because someone is under 18, "grown ups" automatically think that they are stupid. My best friend's dad works for an accounting company, my friend wrote a new program for his dad for the sole purpose that he wanted to help. His dad told his executive that his son wrote it. His exe just laughed and said that a kid was too stupid to wirte a program like that. His dad joined in and got a pay raise for supposedly writing the program.

No one listens to teenagers, they just laugh at our dreams and tell us to keep our heads out of the clouds and in the books. There is a girl at school who dreams of becomming a porn star. Yeah yeah, wierd dreams but she isnt a slut. Her parents detest the idea and want her to work as a lawyer. Im sorry but I will put a gun to my head before I become an accountant or lawyer.

"Adults" also think they know whats best for us. Social workers who advise people that have mentaly disturbed kids, GODS those people are creepy. My cousin killed herself after a social worker told her mom that the best way to prevent her from doing that was sticking her in the loony bin, or words to that effect. "Adults" think that because they were once teenagers that they are experts.

 

There are a lot of issues in your post. First, nobody has the right to do the following things (in the UK):

• Rape someone
• Have sex with a 15 year old
• Stab someone with a pair of scissors (although in some cases of self-defense I believe it may be allowed)

People can be prosecuted for any of those things, whether adult or adolescent. The law may take a more lenient view on an adolescent, but that's about the only disctinction I'm aware of under the law. Some people may view the word of teenagers as having less weight, but that is a mistake, not a law.

As for stupidity, it goes back to my previous post. Some adults listen only to other adults. Some teenagers listen only to other teenagers. Both situations are counter-productive.

About teachers: clearly it is wrong to assume anyone is stupid. However, teachers fundamentally have to assume that their pupils hold less knowledge, on a particular subject, than them. I believe many of them make the mistake of thinking this automatically makes their opinion "more valid" than that of a pupil on any subject. Then again, it seems to me that good pupils (who demonstrate a willingness to learn) have less trouble in this regard than bad pupils.

It is also inescapable that experience can be a source of knowledge, wisdom or insight. Adults tend to have more experience in many things, and (statistically) have a greater chance of being knowledgeable and or having acheived some kind of insight on a given subject.

I don't like making assumptions of this kind, and actively try to avoid dealing with someone based upon which groups they belong to. I'd rather deal with an individual.

I should point out that in your post you make a clear distinction between "us" and "them." You say adults treat teenagers as if they're stupid, and noone listens to what teenagers have to say. As an adult who strives to listen to all people, regardless of age, I feel you're making an unfair predjudice against me.

Being an adult is no guarantee people will listen to what you'll say. I've come up with many, many ideas that have been ignored by various people I have worked with. I have been treated as though I'm stupid quite a lot too (a bit too often to be coincidence, some might say :grin: ).

Adults get raped. Adults get stabbed. Adults get thrown in the loony bin. These are not problems caused by being a teenager, although that probably puts specific spin on each problem.

Respect cannot be demanded. It must be earned. The sad truth is that some people, both adults and teenagers, just don't have much respect for others. They may use the fact you're teenager to deride you. However they probably find reasons to deride adults as well.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Sheriff Fatman on 2002-02-07 23:14 ]</font>

 

The only thing that bothers me is how lenient our society is with teens. (minors) I think that a teen should be tried as an adult for certain crimes (murder, etc..) But then again I DO understand Fatman's arguments about how a teen-ager's mind does some crazy things... I am just 21, so I remember what goes on.. But I still think that we need a little bit tougher laws on our teens. (In America, I mean, I don't know how it is elsewhere)

But YeaYea, I ALSO understand your opinion of the world looking down on teens. I take it you are a teen yourself? Well, having just been there, I agree with you. But, the world was hard on mine and your fathers, and their fathers, and their fathers before them. It does go back to adults having been teens, but teens haven't been adults. Adults know what it is like to have been a teen so therefore they watch you with a hawks-eye.

My two cents..(even though it WAS somewhat repetitive of previous posts) :wink:


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: retard on 2002-02-07 23:46 ]</font>

 

If you think America needs tougher laws for teens your'e definitely barking up the wrong tree. America is infamous for it's, let's say, less civilized justice-system. Tough laws are a short-sighted and inefficient method of limiting crime. It's the underlying problems that must be fought.

 

I agree with you 100% on that, Gonk.

 

Im sorry Sherif, I probably should have added that not all adults have that mentality. And yes I am a teenager, most adults assume that wisdom comes with age, because you are old you are wise and that anyone younger than you automatically has a lower worth opion. And Rhia stabbed her dad entirely in self defense, yet her dad claimed that she had done it on purpose. The courts do not take the word of a teenager over an adults.

 

Less than civilized? Have you seen American prisons?

 

I feel very strongly on this issue relating to the United States and the treatment of "almost adult" status given to those between the ages of 18 and 21.

IMO, you either are or you are not. i.e., if a person is judged old enough to be held accountable for contractual obligations, then they are adults with all the rights and burdens thereof.

In this country, at 18 you may enlist into the military without parental approval; but cannot buy a beer. Back when I enlisted, 21 was the legal drinking age; however in the state of West Virginia the authorities permitted anyone to drink if they were a member of our armed forces. The drinking age was lowered to 18 a few years later (which was changed back to 21 some time in the '70's).

Before my 21st year I had captured 6 Chinese Regulars, carried an M60 machinegun, safeguarded priority A resources, set a number of protocols, averted a major international incident, and even made the cover of Stars and Stripes; but today I would only have almost adult status. If a young man or woman is not considered to have enough commonsense for full fledged membership participation, then viewing them as adults in the eyes of the law should be considered taking undo advantage of an often illspent resource.

In reference to those younger than 18: the world has too many dickbumps eager to take gross advantage of anyone and we are most susceptable during our early years. Protection without becoming overbearing is a delicate formulae which seemingly alludes an insufferable majority of parents. Permitting an increasing amount of external beaurocratic influence inside the family unit is less an answer than it is a problem; however the frustrations of those ill equipped to raise our precious young remains their accelerant.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Odi on 2002-02-08 08:47 ]</font>

 

And in english that means???

 

It basically means, "Do your own damn homework."

 

Okay, I'm going to give my perspective now.

I'm 18 years old. I'm old enough to do anything I want in my country (Australia, if you haven't figured that out yet). I can drive (I do), I can drink (I do), I can rent and watch R rated material (I do), I can buy and view pornography (occasionally) and I can smoke (I don't). If I was caught by the law for doing something illegal, I would be tried for an adult.

Under the law here, some crimes have different ages to be tried as an adult for. I'm not sure what those ages are, but I can theorise that the reason for this is that the court system believes that once you reach a certain age you have been educated enough to realise certain actions are wrong and against the law. For instance, I believe that for murder, the adult age isn't 18, but something like 15 or 16. The system assumes that by that age you've learnt that murder is wrong, therefore you can be tried as an educated adult.

As for your complaint that teenagers are never believed in court - have you ever read or seen the play The Crucible? In that movie, some teenagers decided that some local people were getting in the way of some fun of theirs, so they schemed together and pretended that they used witchcraft to frighten them. Their schemes succeeded for a while, and many people of the town were excommunicated and hanged. Eventually, the girls are exposed as frauds, but not before many people are dead. The point is, if you give teenagers power and the benefit of the doubt, they can use that power to wreck lives and distort the truth. As a result of those aforementioned hormones, they either can't conceive of, or don't care about, the results of their actions. The fact is, many teenagers have lied in the past to get adults into trouble, just for the fun of it. Sometimes it's too late before they realise what they've done and tried to rectify it.

On the whole, it is safe to assume that adults are to be believed over teenagers, and that adults are generally wiser, better educated and all that sort of stuff. Teenagers often don't understand the consequences of their actions when it comes to the crunch, and believing a shopkeeper instead of a group of unruly kids with wide eyes and all that crap is generally the correct course of action.

I think that teenagers should have the basic rights that everyone gets, but they should also learn to take responsibility for their actions - once they've learned to should that responsibility, they should then get the full rights and privileges of adults.

 

Well....I sorta agree with you. But Rhia didnt kill her dad, she stabbed him in the leg, twice in self defense. And it is not generally a rule that "adults" are smarter than teenagers. Lookit GW Bush, biggest moron that ever scratched his armpits and hes runnin the flippin country.

 

I'd hazard a guess and say that your teacher is smarter than you, both your parents are smarter than you, and the old man living across the street is smarter than you. Hell, even Milo is probably smarter than you. I said generally, not always.

As for Dubya:

1. He isn't my President. Suck shit :smile:.
2. No one said you needed intelligence to become a politician. All you need is Daddy's credit card and Swiss bank account number.

 

Don't hold back, Jar!
YeaYea, I can relate to some of the things you're saying. But see if you can detect a little of the kids you know in what I say: Waaaay back when, before fire was invented, I managed a string of carwashes. Most of my employees were high-school kids, and for many of them this was their first job. I was in my early twenties at the time.
I played several roles: boss, teacher, disciplinarian, and friend.
The kids got pissed when I dragged them back from their break to go to work. "Hey, I'm talking to my girlfriend!"
The kids got pissed when I taught them how to do the job. They already knew all that stuff. And if the customer didn't like the job because it wasn't up to snuff -- "fuck him! It's not my company".
The kids got pissed at me when they were late for work (by hours) and I refused to pay them for a full day's work. "Come on! I got a car payment!"
And when I was a friend (which I always tried to be), I discovered that the kids didn't take me seriously in my other roles.
So, I had to be the bad guy.
Many adults find that they have to be the bad-guy, and step on your rights. It's too bad things are that way, but it's not all the fault of the adults.
Let's say all teenagers did whatever they wanted, without adult interference.
Let's take the girl at your school (not literally, yet) who wants to be a porn star. Do you think maybe someone should talk her out of it? I do. But, I'm an adult. What do teen-agers think?
Or your friends who are in Juvenile Hall. Did they do the sensible thing? I don't think so. But, then again, I'm an adult. What do teen-agers think?
I remember being a teen-ager, and it was the most chaotic, confusing, and intense period of my life. It was also a lot of fun. But everything mattered SOOOOOO much.
I will live forever, but this moment is all that matters.
But adults know that it isn't just about THIS moment, because there's a moment after that, and actions have consequences.
I think a big problem occurs when a kid says, "Why can't I do such-and-such?" and the adult says, "Because I said so". Adults have to explain their actions, and include personal experiences. Often adults are afraid to tell kids that they did the same thing when they were teen-agers, because the kids will figure that if Dad did it, and became successful, it must be okay. But teen-agers have to listen! Parents want to spare their children the pain it took to gain experience.
If more teen-agers listened to adults (not just any adults, of course, just me and those who think as I do), there would be less teen-age pregnancy, gang violence, and death before the age of 20.
I've rambled long enough, but I've been out of town and away from the 'puter for a while.
At least you seem to have your head on straight, YeaYea. :smile:

 

RE : I would like your guys's opinon

Having been a teenager myself(I am now 22y)and Having two younger brothers one is 20 and the other almost 17. I can look back and relate to them and how I perceived myself at their age. I beleive this world revolves around credibility. It seems the older the you are the more credibility you have.So when it comes down to rights and defending ones right it all relies on the persons credibility and unfortunatly, teenagers dont have a huge amount.

Also you have to ask your self what makes teenagers different from adults? I live in Australia and over here you are classed as an adult at the age of 18(you can drinl,smoke,night club and you are now legally reponsable)When I turned 18 I didn't any different from when I was 16 or 17years old.So, back to the question, teenagers unfortunatly dont have near as much consideration for other people as adults do.Also it comes back to responsibilities, action and consequences. teenagers generally do not always think of consequences and how it affects other people.This is due to lack of maturity and maturity is something you have to learn, you cant be taught.

My younger brother(the 20y old) has caused a huge amount of problems with my family.It's due to lack of respect.What most teenagers dont realise is that adults have been there and done it all before, so isn't it logical to assume that they might know what they are talking about as they have personal experience and you do not.I agree adults shouldn't hold it agianst teeanagers because of this lack of experience.Now, my brother did not respect or parents opinions and beleived he knew more about a certain subject than our parents did.He might have on certain occasions, but I found because the advice comes from an adult he immediatly puts up a wall and refuses to take the information on board.(now he is $10000 in debt)

Technically we need to have an age where a person is classed as an adult 18 or 21 depending where you live.And It's my opinion that there should be seperate laws to protect teenagers from themselves and other people who would try to take advantage.

But in the end respect is something you have to earn.No matter who you are or how old you are.