Evolution of a 'Jolly Old Elf'

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by RPjunkie, Dec 21, 2003.

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Do you believe in Santa Claus?

Poll closed Jan 4, 2004.
  1. yes

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  2. no

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  3. yes, but only for younger ppl (kids/cousins/siblings/etc.)

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  4. no, but fake it for the little ones

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  5. why??

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  6. why not!!! It makes the season interesting.

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  1. RPjunkie

    RPjunkie New Member

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    Found this site while looking for stories for my daughter (2 1/2 yrs) and thought that is was rather interesting. Read this and see where he really came from. Also learn about the reindeer thing-as well as Rudolph. This is from The History Channel's website, so I'm sure that everything is factual.

    I'm sure there are other sites out there. The Coca-Cola company has published a book (Twas the Night Before Christmas) in which a brief history of Santa Claus is included. History shows that before the release of a promotional can by the company to attempt to make Coke a year round beverage in stead of just summer, America's view/vision of Santa Claus was as varied as the cultures living here. The artist hired to create a few seens for the company (Sundblum) is responsible for the way America now pictures Santa. It is said that after that first promotional season, the Coca-Cola Santa became the embodiment of Santa common throughout the country.

    What does Santa Claus/St. Nicholas/Kris Kringle look like in other countries?? I am also curious to see what the different customs are and learn about your Santas. Let us here at HoL learn something interesting this holiday season.
     
  2. Jinxed

    Jinxed Active Member

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    Elf? I read the same stuff you posted... Only difference was that he was an overgrown dwarf.
     
  3. Dark Elf

    Dark Elf Administrator Staff Member

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    Well, around here, Santa comes to your house and delivers out the presents at Christmas Eve (What? That's not dad with some fake beard! What the hell are you talking about! Anyway, were's dad...)

    It's rather interesting that in the past, people believed in a small kind of creature called a "tomte" (which, for the records, is "Santa" in Swedish...) Those were small gnomes, with red hats and white beards, looking quite the same way Santa does today. They could help you with the farming and such, but you had to watch out so you didn't annoy the little bastard, 'cause then it could get real mad and punch a cow to death or something (they were strong little freaks...). You had to give it a bowl of porridge on Christmas Eve among other things...

    Uh, what's up with the poll by the way? Do you believe in... hey! What are you proposing man? Well, I'll tell you, that poll is completely obsolete, because SANTA EXISTS DAMNIT!

    ...right?
     
  4. RPjunkie

    RPjunkie New Member

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    Dark Elf said:
    Yes he does exist. Those that say he doesn't are just pissed cause they didn't get everything they asked for one year. They have an edipul complex with Santa.

    HE DOES EXIST!!! Not just metaphorically in our imaginations!! I was just asking who believed he does. I was not questioning his existence personally-I know he's real!!
     
  5. labyrinthian

    labyrinthian New Member

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    In the Czech Republic, there is no Santa. Well, they know who he is because of the Russian Father Christmas and American marketing, but he doesn't deliver presents. Baby Jesus flies around the country, entering through windows to deliver gifts.

    But that's not their best custom: that would be Easter, when all males run around with sticks and beat the girls on their legs to ensure their future fertility. In Slovakia, the boys dump water on the girls, which seems more humane, save that it's pretty cold in April there.
     
  6. Wolf

    Wolf New Member

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    Rp, I'm very disappointed in you.
     
  7. RPjunkie

    RPjunkie New Member

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    disappointed!?!?

    why, what on earth for wolfie??
     
  8. Sleek_Jeek

    Sleek_Jeek New Member

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    Oooooohhhh, you silly Czechnians.

    Santa is not real Rpjunkie, the best explanation I could think of for his existence would be that he does exist but he is so fed up and cynical from years of delivering presents to the undeserving that he just sits up on the north pole and watches sitcoms, andeats cookies all year.
     
  9. Wolf

    Wolf New Member

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    I"m disappointed because you said you believed in Santa Clause. Whether you're one of thos people that say they think he exists or you actually believe in him I'm not sure. I believe it is the former.
     
  10. Silvara

    Silvara New Member

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    Well, here we believe Santa enters through your chimney and delivers and has the sleigh and reindeer and stuff. Kind of like you Americans, but if you think a bit it's silly because we celebrate Christmas during summer, and if Santa came with those clothes he'd die (I mean, these few days it's been more or less 30°C! Imagine a fat guy with winter clothing and reindeer dissolving in the heat...). We also believe that on the 6th of January the three Magi go on their camels and give presents to children. You know the part of the Gospel where it says that when Jesus was born there came three wise men from far away, following a star, and brought a present each (gold, myrrh, and frankincense, I think they were). Well, those guys.
     
  11. Qilikatal

    Qilikatal New Member

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    Haha here we have the same traditions as in sweden only we call him a nisse. He is strong as hell and keep the årsgardsreia away. The årsgårdsreia is by the way the evil powers who ride across the sky and causes harm and damage. And the nisse keeps them away. also He should not be pissed of and he wants porridge and not that cheap crap made on rice. No he wants porridge made on sour cream (or something like that) I think you can make it on butter as well. And if you don`t fix it for him the beer and moonshine will go bad and the food will go rotten.
     
  12. Jarinor

    Jarinor New Member

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    Yeah, it's strange hearing that song "White Christmas" when you spend half the day in the pool and/or drinking beer.

    Recent efforts by certain people, none known to me, have modified the 'Santa Claus mythos' if you will, so that he has kangaroos instead of reindeer. Actually, now that I think about it, it was just Rolf Harris. It's not a bad song though.
     
  13. labyrinthian

    labyrinthian New Member

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    OK, Wolf, here's the thing. Some adults have this thing worth treasuring: it's called a sense of wonder, an appreciation of the beauties of childhood. And so, when RPJ says he believes in Santa Claus, what he's saying is he believes in the warmth in his heart that ignites when he pretends to believe. Think, kid: the guy is a father. Do you really think he just waits for Santa to bring his child presents?

    This is one thing you will simply not know until you are actually as mature as you think you are. You have to feel regret over having lost your childhood before you can become wistful over it, and that can't happen when you are just exiting childhood.
     
  14. RPjunkie

    RPjunkie New Member

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    labyrinthian said:
    Ya know lab, I have one thing to say about this: THANK YOU!!! Why is so hard for people to understand that you are only as young/old as you feel. I grew up with a saying that I very much believe in:
    Why people cannot accept this I do not know.

    I learned very young that the most important thing to hold onto in life is the innocence of your childhood. I honestly believe that if you lose that, then you might as well be dead. I say this because, you have no real passion for life. How can you enjoy things, and be adventurous when you cannot apperciate, or have no appreciation, of things like imagination?!?!

    If you cannot believe in such things as Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, gnomes, flying reindeer, elves, etc. Then there is no wonder that this world has become more and more cynical. It does not surprise me that we all would rather fight, slander, maim, kill, pillage, destroy, and condemn others for what they choose to believe-rather than accept the differences and learn to appreciate things such as the innocence of childhood.

    I DO believe in Santa Claus!!! But that does not give grounds to flame me, or say you are disappointed. (if you are then keep it to yourself-I'd rather not know that you have lost your childlike quality in your heart)

    I TRULY BELIEVE THAT ONE CAN FOREVER BE A CHILD IF THEY CHOOSE TO BELIEVE!!!
     
  15. Qilikatal

    Qilikatal New Member

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    Cmon he is growing, and at his age it is usuall to look down at the small and "superstious" kids and cool to be intelligent and fully grown.

    On the other hand, Wolf it is fun to hold on to some tradition and to say that it is very stupid to belive in something a little magic is stupid, atleast just to say it. Maybe he was just joking and maybe not maybe he belives in santa claus or not but who cares. You don`t go around telling every christian you meet how disapointed you are that he is religious, do you?

    I think it is great when people gather arpund the christmas tree and sings songs or gather at friends houses to taste akevitt. Not long ago i swam around a christmas tree singing christmas song. Great fun just great fun. Enjoy it now you might not later. Life is to short for beeing serious all the time you know.

    PS: Ohh and I don`t belive in santa claus, amongst other things it is because i have seen what they call "santas home" in finland, bigger tourist trap than anything you have ever seen fuck even my dad was angry. Don`t go there RP it will destroy all your dreams of santa.
     
  16. Darkwalker

    Darkwalker Member

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    Michael Jackson was fond of that saying, just look where he's at for the Holidays. :)

    Just teasing RPJunkie, Hope you and your family have a wonderful Christmas.
     
  17. Blinky969

    Blinky969 Active Member

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    Santa embodies the spirit of Christmas and good will toward men. How can you say you disapprove of that? You're disapproving of the very spirit of kindness and generosity. If you want to do that, why even bother having a celebration?
     
  18. Jarinor

    Jarinor New Member

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    I can get in the spirit of these events, but I don't know I can say I believe. That said, I don't have a problem with people who do or don't, as long as those who don't don't give shit to those who do.
     
  19. DrFraud

    DrFraud New Member

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    What about people for whom Christmas is just another day? Do you guys who think everybody should believe in Santa slam Jewish people for not believing in him? Or Muslims or Wiccans or people who celebrate Kwanzaa instead? If not, why not?

    I happen to believe that it isn't necessary to be childish in order to remain childlike. And believing in a total myth is just that - childish, IMO. Yes, there was a real, living man called Saint Nicholas who existed at one time in the past. But there certainly isn't an immortal being in a red suit who flies around delivering presents to all the people who believe or even half-believe in his existence in a single night.

    I have an excellent imagination, if I do say so myself. I use it frequently - when making up stories or poems or silly games to play with kids. But using it to believe in Santa or alien abductions or Bigfoot or anything else evidentially improbable would be a total waste of my critical thinking faculties, IMO.

    Yes, I believe in Christmas, and in the spirit of Christmas, but it isn't necessary to believe in a fat man in a red suit in order to believe in either of those things.

    Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, Joyous Yule, Excellent Festivus, or whatever other holiday sentiment fits your beliefs.
     
  20. Wolf

    Wolf New Member

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    There is adifference between believing and fooling yourself. You can't make yourself believe in something. When I was younger I was scared shitless of death. I didn't believe in Heaven but I wanted to. I'd tell myself that it did exist but it never helpt. One day I decided to accept and embrace atheism. I feel much better. I'm never afraid. Us atheists still have fun, but we still spit on you and your religions*. What's the use in being childlike? It's just another way of fooling yourself. How can you say you believe in Santa, but secretly buy presents for your kids? Why not just stay awake all night waiting for Santa? You people tell me that I shouldn't say I'm dissapointed. Why the hell not? I am disappointed. Not that he believes in God, but that he says he believes in Santa. It's a fact that Santa doesn't exist. Bag me all you guys like, I don't give a shit.

    *This is joke, ok
     
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