E-Cigs?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Grossenschwamm, Oct 27, 2011.

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Have people truly quit smoking if they now use an E-Cigarette?

  1. Yes

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  2. No

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  1. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    Alright, you're probably familiar with the things. And, you can probably agree that the people using them have quit smoking-on a technicality. As there's nothing actually burning, it's true that no smoke is produced.

    However, many of these people still crave nicotine. This craving is satisfied by filters and vaporizing solutions of varying concentration, from 0 up to 36 mg of the stimulant. Is it hard to stop a nicotine habit when you're hooked? Of course. It's been likened to quitting heroine or crack. Nicotine is far more deadly than either of those things, though.

    Let's look at the average dose capable of killing at least 50% of those who take it regarding the three substances;

    Crack= 1.2 grams

    Heroine= 200-500 milligrams

    Nicotine= 30-60 milligrams

    Because tobacco is still such a huge part of modern culture, people don't really know how deadly nicotine can be; though that's not why this thread was made.
     
  2. ytzk

    ytzk Well-Known Member

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    Sucking tar into your lungs is a big health risk.

    The number of indian housewives who die of lung problems because they cook without a chimney is an example.

    Nicotine is a good antidepressant and one of a very few drugs which increase your IQ in the short term. Although carcinogenic as the pure molecule, it's actually quite benign compared to smoke, with or without nicotine.

    Anyhow, autistically speaking, of course they're not smoking if there's no smoke to smoke.

    I'm sure it's less carcinogenic than (1) an iphone or (2) the UV at my local beach on a sunny day.
     
  3. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    Caffeine does this as well, and it's also less potent than nicotine, meaning you can fine-tune your consumption to a greater degree depending on your needs, though this is mainly due to the ability to purchase raw caffeine wholesale in bulk amounts. In either case, you'd need a very sensitive measure.
    However, both drugs have been linked to anxiety, restlessness, and hypertension. Also, headaches. Ironically, people who develop these symptoms (except for hypertension) because they haven't had either nicotine or caffeine can obtain relief by consuming their therapeutic amount, though it is debatable whether or not these symptoms of absence are due to withdrawal or not having adequate "treatment."

    Indeed. One of those Occam's Razor deals.
     
  4. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    Say what? Of course they haven't quit smoking if they're still sucking on a nicotine producing stick. "Smoking" in this context doesn't mean "inhaling smoke", it means "having to get a regular nicotine fix". What do you think they'd do if they lost their e-cigarette? Run out and buy some tobacco - that's what.
     
  5. Arthgon

    Arthgon Well-Known Member

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    The problem with e-CIGS that the chemicals in it would be more dangerous than regular cigarettes. At least they say so.
     
  6. TheDavisChanger

    TheDavisChanger Well-Known Member

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    I'm pretty sure regardless of context "smoking" means "inhaling smoke." There's really no way around that.

    Sure, these blokes have quit smoking, but they haven't curbed their addiction. With which is this poll concerned?
     
  7. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    Well, as I tend to do, I went off on a bit of a tangent. However, the poll is designed to see what you all think about these people having quit smoking, not whether they're addicted to nicotine. So, in this way, the question is;
    Have they quit smoking simply by nature of their inhalation, or have they continued smoking because they still get nicotine the same way?
    The question exists because I don't know of anyone smoking to get the arsenic or ammonia into their bodies, nor precisely the fiberglass to make tiny lacerations (though this does aid in nicotine absorption). They do it for the nicotine (and the flavor). The E-Cig gives both nicotine and flavor, curbing the need to actually burn tobacco leaves and whatever filler is present in a Newport (though if you buy American Spirits, they're 100% tobacco).
     
  8. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    Yes there is. It's similar to the word "drinking". If someone tells you they've given up drinking, and you later see them imbibing water, do you say "Aha! You haven't given up drinking after all, you rapist."

    No, you don't, because "drinking" has more than one meaning. Just like "smoking" has more than one meaning. If it always meant "inhaling smoke" then you could never give up smoking without also giving up attending barbecues.
     
  9. Jojobobo

    Jojobobo Well-Known Member

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    I think they've quit, someone who only chews nicotine gum or uses patches is considered to have quit smoking so why not them? This is a separate issue from still being addicted to nicotine though.
     
  10. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    They aren't considered to have quit smoking - they're considered to be trying to quit smoking.
     
  11. TheDavisChanger

    TheDavisChanger Well-Known Member

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    Just because both are supposed vices does not mean that they are subject to the same restraints of context!

    If someone were to ask me "Do you drink?" I would answer in the affirmative because I understand that their question is "Do you drink (alcoholic beverages as recreation)?" By virtue that I am living and breathing and able to answer the blamed question is a testament to the fact that I drink water or the like. The fact that I drink water is understood so it is seldom the subject of an inquiry.

    With smoking, it's quite different. If someone were to ask me two years ago "Do you smoke?" I would not have answered in the affirmative because the question is not "Do you (ever--even accidentally--inhale) smoke?" Likewise, a firefighter who does not deliberately combust cigarettes, cigars, or tobacco in pipes for the purpose of inhaling the product is not expected to answer this question in the affirmative.
     
  12. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, that's my point. In this context, "smoking" doesn't mean "inhaling smoke", it means "using cigarettes". And since an e-cigarette is a form of cigarette (the clue is in the name), someone using them is still "smoking".

    Just as someone who consumes jello shots is still "drinking" even though they are not imbibing a liquid.
     
  13. Jungle Japes

    Jungle Japes Well-Known Member

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    Gelatin is just liquid in disguise. DO NOT BE DECEIVED!
     
  14. TheDavisChanger

    TheDavisChanger Well-Known Member

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    OK, I guess I'm approaching this from a more clinical view. A doctor would be concerned with whether or not actual cigarettes are being consumed, and I would imagine consider the use of E-Cigs not smoking.
     
  15. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    That's an interesting perspective - I hadn't thought about that. I was coming at it more from a drug addiction angle.

    So it turns out that everyone is right in their own way. Isn't that nice. Smiley face.
     
  16. TheDavisChanger

    TheDavisChanger Well-Known Member

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  17. Archmage Orintil

    Archmage Orintil New Member

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    The stuff doesn't work for me. Neither does the gum or the patch. Makes me wonder if I'm addicted to nicotine or just the act of inhaling noxious gases.
     
  18. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    From what smokers have told me, it's a combination of a psychological addiction and a chemical one. For these people, getting an e-cig and inhaling from that stimulates the psychological need as well as the chemical. I guess it just doesn't work that way for everybody, but then, there's no guaranteed fix for every single person on the planet.
    It's weird for me, though. It was harder to quit smoking pot (which is wholly psychological) than it was for me to stop smoking hookah up to 3 times a day, which carries a chemical and psychological hook. It took many very bad experiences to stop using cannabis, but with the hookah, I just decided I didn't want to smoke that much anymore and completely stopped doing it outside of a group setting. Have I completely quit? Not by a long stretch. But, going from up to 21 preparations a week down to 1 or 2 every 2 weeks (and only with friends) is a considerable break in the habit, especially since I had smoked 3 times the day I decided to stop and didn't touch a hose until about 2 weeks later.
     
  19. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    I knew someone who used to smoke and drink, and has now given up both. He said that he found giving up alcohol was far more difficult than cigarettes, which I found interesting. I guess that means in his case the psychological factors were dominant, and he had a stronger attachment to being drunk than to standing outside in the rain for a smoke every hour.
     
  20. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    Would he have been classified as an alcoholic while he was still drinking?
    A friend of mine is a functional alcoholic (and he confirms it-he got alcohol poisoning on a high school trip to Ireland and killed a kidney), and I know a few other people who are non-functional and have only succeeded in severely cutting back. The ones who cut back don't enjoy drinking anymore (but still insist) because it's impossible for them to catch a buzz. Even further, some people I know but no longer speak to would say "I'm an alcoholic, so I shouldn't be drinking at all, but..."
    When it comes to drinking, it can really depend on the person...but that's true for just about everything.
     
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