Hey Guys

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by DarkFool, Nov 25, 2011.

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  1. Arthgon

    Arthgon Well-Known Member

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    Apparently, Zanza wrote his post while I already wrote another sentance. (about how Mansee could have known about Tel.) So I have not changed anything in my post.
     
  2. Muro

    Muro Well-Known Member

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  3. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    Okay, so Zanza was probably referring to Gross's comment about English being hard to learn. I don't think it's the hardest though - not compared to something like Mandarin. I mean... sheesh, have you checked that mofo out? No wonder the Chinese are going to dominate the next century - they've all developed genius level IQs by the age of three just by learning to speak.
     
  4. Arthgon

    Arthgon Well-Known Member

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    Muro: Alright. If you look that way then I have changed my post indeed.
     
  5. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    Hebrew is supposed to be harder to learn than English, but I don't know if Mandarin is harder to understand from a literary standpoint or a cultural standpoint. Most other languages use letters to build words. Mandarin, Korean, and Japanese, as far as I can tell, will use simple characters to do that as well as more complicated characters to represent the whole word to save on space. It's said that the more ignorant Japanese will rely mostly on Kanji to spell things out, unable to really comprehend the more complex Mandarin based Hiragana characters. What they're supposed to be are pictures, so it's a similar system to heiroglyphs and it was developed at around the same time, but people are still using it today because I guess it's a simpler system. Still, tens of thousands of characters. The alphabet is huge, and then there are the actual words...yeah, I guess this is a way of me agreeing that Mandarin is a hard language to learn. Inflection is a big part of speaking, because your vowel sounds in a word (even using the same vowels) will change the meaning of the word.
     
  6. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    1. Chinese characters don't have any "letters to build words" - they're all ideographic.
    2. In Japanese, it's Kanji which is based on Chinese characters. Hiragana and Katakana map to phonemes.
    3. I think you mean that the tone of a vowel in Mandarin changes the word. Not the vowel of a vowel.

    Apart from these points, you summarised it well.
     
  7. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    See, that's what happens when I've previously researched something but didn't brush up on it before posting it. I had actually forgotten the word for what the characters are, but knew it started with the "ideo" prefix, and instead clumsily went with "letters to build words." I just figured it'd be adequate because they technically do the same thing but in a different way. And yes, I did mean intonation and thought I had said that but I guess I didn't. I meant that many words can have the same consonants and vowels, but a different intonation for the vowel (or even the consonant) will change what word it is. Probably should've said that instead.
    Hell, time doesn't even work the same way for the Chinese. The past is above them and they're falling into the future. We, on the other hand, are perpetually moving forward. Is it describing the same phenomenon? Sure, but in a different way.
    Languages and cultures vary so much from place to place that not everyone can see the same colors until they learn the proper language to describe it. Sure, their eyes work the same, but if there's no word for pink in a person's language, they'll end up calling it red if there's a word for that instead.
     
  8. Manshee

    Manshee New Member

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    Maybe I am smoking too much high grade Afghan Kush and I'm looking far too deeply between the lines here, but I can't help but notice a similarity in the actions undertaken by those of you that seem to have taken a disliking to me. You seem to try and steer the attention of a thread as far away from me as possible. This hurts deeply, especially when it's people like you Gross. I thought we had a connection dude? Oh wait, nevermind, that was my 'Dad you were talking to.
    EDIT: Laugh.
    I am a changed man these day's you really must remember that. No crazy antics or rediculous behaviour. A simple antagonist is all I am.
     
  9. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    I don't know what you think is actually happening, but I'm not angry with you anymore. I dealt with that a while ago, and it kind of seems like you're the one holding on to it. If you regret it, ok, whatever, it was a prank. If you don't, again, prank. Smoke your kush, be happy, antagonize. Seems to be your thing, you might as well do what makes you happy. You can easily antagonize and contribute, but that's up to you.
     
  10. Manshee

    Manshee New Member

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    I am now talking to you as a sane human being. I am very sorry for what I did. It was a drunken prank masterminded in the 15 minutes it took to get half way through a litre of gin. As far as you go Gross, eat shit and die.
    I saw a low flying aeroplanes sign today and there was at the time a plane flying overhead. The sign sent me into a stoned panic and all I could think to do was drop to the floor. Also, due to a few issues of my own I shit myself.
    There I was facedown in the mud, shit all over my ass and a grazed knee like only the brave kids that went out into the forrest and battled child hungry imaginary bears used to get.
    I sobbed.
    F.I.N
     
  11. Arthgon

    Arthgon Well-Known Member

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    It seems that I was right after all. HWLFP is back, indeed.

    Gross: Is Hebrew or Madarine more difficultly to learn when you are English or when you are from a non-English country? In case of the spoken language and reading. Just wondering about this sort of thing.
     
  12. DarkFool

    DarkFool Nemesis of the Ancients

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    A Dark Fool, in fact.

    Keep you in line? No. It's more that I get sick of your Smuelia and Smuelissimo accounts.
     
  13. Constipation

    Constipation New Member

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    Not only were you right and the first to figure it out, you even shared your observation in the form of a witty reference. You are such a smart and cool guy, I want to be like you when I grow up.
     
  14. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    I would not be the person to tell you that, as I have not tried to learn either. But, Jews are all over the world and know both their country's language and enough Hebrew to have a successful bar/batmitzvah. Do I know what "enough" means? No. But I know anyone who's had either of those ceremonies knows a lot more Hebrew than I do.
    I think any language is easier to learn when the one you start with is similar to it, or you already know one based on the same thing. But, there's the magic of false cognates;
    In the english language, if you say someone is embarrassed that means they're self conscious. In spanish, the word "embarasado" means either "pregnant" or "to make pregnant."
    A teacher in my school district made that mistake while talking to a hispanic student who knew enough english to get by, but not the more complex words, as he had just moved to the states to learn more english in an exchange program.
    Obviously, the teacher didn't know the meaning of embarasado, but it sounded like another word. He embarrasses a female student (who he was living with because she was his exchange family sister) and the teacher sees her body language. After class, the teacher tells him the girl felt embarrassed from what he did and it's not right to make people feel self conscious.
    He doesn't know the word embarrassed or the phrase "self conscious". She's heard "embarasado" before and said "You embarasado her."
    His face drains of color and he freaks out, because the teacher effectively accused him of getting this girl pregnant.
    Now, I'm not saying that would happen necessarily with Hebrew or Mandarin as compared to english, but it could literally happen in any case where two given languages contain phonetically similar words that just don't mean the same thing.
     
  15. TheDavisChanger

    TheDavisChanger Well-Known Member

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    I prefer the Smuelissimo account. You banned the wrong one.
     
  16. ytzk

    ytzk Well-Known Member

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    I'm a native english speaker and I enjoy learning weird languages. Hebrew, Mandarin and Sanskrit are all very different to English, but it's clear even superficially that they are all more homogenous than English and follow more internally consistent rules. The tricksiest bit is the alien scripts.

    This makes english the weirdest of all, IMO, because it's a mishmash of conventions, rather than a coherent system.
     
  17. Philes

    Philes Well-Known Member

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    DF, every time I see you posting seriously about Mod-related duties I recall the one time several years ago that you and I were in an IRC chat for CyberNations somewhere. I recall you freaking out about some alliance bullshit that you started. I don't remember the exact details (which makes this a Cool Story Bro I suppose) but I do recall me saving the day. Makes me keekle.

    What this forum needs is 1-2 more people to delete spam accounts/whatever that aren't total nutjobs. Sadly, that leaves a pool of exactly zero people to draw from.
     
  18. Smuel

    Smuel Well-Known Member

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    That hasn't stopped them promoting moderators and admins in the past.

    If you go by the English-speaking diplomatic services, they allow up to four times longer for diplomats to learn Chinese, Japanese or Korean compared to European languages. Of course, this could just be because Asian languages are further removed from Indo-European ones. However, I've heard that Japanese and Chinese people have a tough time learning each other's languages too, because they are not very similar at all, despite the shared use of Kanji/Hanzi characters. It would be interesting to run a survey in those countries - do they find English easier or harder to learn than their neighbouring languages?

    Nobody really bothers to learn Hebrew though, except religious fanatics and philosophical weirdos, so your specific question will remain unanswered.
     
  19. Grossenschwamm

    Grossenschwamm Well-Known Member

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    I was Vorak's idea. Of course, I think it's more of a title. GD is rather self-moderating. All I really do is lock spambot threads as directed by DF, though I could as easily as he can delete them.
     
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