Arcanum graphics...

Where is my Tim Cain? - Arcanum
Where is my gore? - Arcanum (Though not as much)
Where is my 2d Engine? - Arcanum
Where is my Turn Based Combat? - Arcanum
Where has all the Fallout gone? - Err... Elsewhere

 

No, Dan. Only the bad guys never hit each other by accident. You suffer from friendly fire all the time (automatic fire only). Nice feature, huh?

 

Actually, I think the main problem with anticipation of the 3D graphics for future Fallout, or, who knows, maybe even Arcanum 2 is the first person view. Indeed I think that when somebody says "3D", everyone else automatically imagines something like Quake or Half-Life.

If the creators of Fallout 3 will use 3D graphics, BUT IT WILL LOOK the same (well, _almost_ the same) as present Fallouts do - in the isometrical 3rd person view - I don't mind buying it actually.

The only thing that I will NEVER understand is that the "turn-based games are less popular than real-time ones". I love turn-based and I will never agree that the statistics is right in this case. I think that it's a matter of the game titles and how they are made. If the game is GREAT and it's in the real-time - people are playing it. If the same thing is true about the turn-based game (like Incubation, for example), people will buy that one as well.

So, if the statictics says that the real-time games are being sold better than the turn-based ones, it means ONLY ONE THING: there are simply more good real-time games then the turn-based ones. So simple it is.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Solid Snake on 2001-05-15 02:41 ]</font>

 

Just because a game uses RT combat it doesen't mean that you have to hack and slash through hordes of mutants all the time.

The amount of combat in FO games was nice but I wouldn't have complained if I had the option to go through most of them a bit faster... When you have to wait for the computer to calculate the actions of dozens of prostitutes, pimps and other scum just because you are fighting a guy in a bar it just get boring...

 

If Black Isle wants a commercial succes..........

Make a 3d level where the maincharacters can run throught shooting raiders with a flagcannon. After u shot them, let the team go to a house where u (as player) can buy furniture and redecorate the room, make love with the neighbour and take a kid and raise it well for 2 monthes, otherwise the computerized child care organisations will steal it away from u. After a good night sleep, let the whole team play basketball (including the playoffs) and give us a crappy championmovie. Then let them race all tracks in a nascar.
And all this for just 50$ for the install and 25$ for each month u wanna play it online. That will do the job.

Bestseller!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Ok, my $0,02.

Are you so sure? My personal opinion is that there's no need in a storyline to sell a that much anticipated game. Why bother? Why spend money? Let's just put the word "Fallout" in the title and it's ready to go.

Yes, unfortunatelly! The point is that each next sequel of any good product becomes more and more hackneyed, because the title itself provides the popularity and it's usually uneconomical to make something good, so nobody bothers. That's a common tendention, and you guys feel it, that's why you want Fallout3 to be closest to the original Fallouts (down to suggestions about F3 using the same engine). But look, it's impossible to make something new without changing anything! The game has to be altered at some points. What I think should not be changed is the so-mich-talked-about atmosphere. If they manage to keep the feel, I'd play the game even if it's a racing simulator (it's actually impossible, so I'm safe :grin: ).

Well, the fact that the thread is still there brings me to another question: how do you know that it's really Feargus? :wink:

That is, Saint.

Moreover, don't forget about the shotguns. They can damage creatures located at a specified angle.

 

I'm not familiar with the expression "chop logic", so I don't really know how to respond to that. And I really don't see how you could have got "Feargus is God" from my post. "3D is God", maybe. But Feargus? I'm not trying to defend him. My post was in response to comments you and others made which condemned 3D games as being somehow a backwards step, that would spell doom (pun unintended) for the Fallout world. I quote again: "EVERY 3d game is either an actiony piece of crap (a la quake) or a stupid Tomb Raider clone."

You say Prov and Krix can speak for a large majority, but they cannot claim to speak for everyone. I'm happy enough for them to claim "I think..." or "a lot of people think..." but if they write "all Fallout fans think..." it marginalises my opinions. If you accept these blanket statements, then when I post a disagreeing opinion I must not be a real Fallout fan, therefore my opinion can be safely written off.

If the story gets butchered, that is going to happen regardless of the engine. FO2 has been panned for not being in keeping with the original's feel as well, and that used pretty much the same engine as FO1.

Who are "they", anyway? I thought FOT was made by a company in Australia whose name I can't remember. FO3 will be made by BIS.

I'm not saying you shouldn't speak your mind either. I don't think I said that anywhere. All I was trying to point out that 3D isn't necessarily a bad thing.

I don't think using a 3D engine constitutes a focus on graphics. It's just a case of moving with the times and keeping up with
technology. I'm not expecting particularly impressive graphics from FO3, or TORN for that matter - they are using the LithTech engine after all. :/

The graphics were improved from Wasteland to Fallout, and the gameplay didn't suffer. Just because FOT wasn't that great doesn't mean FO3 won't be.

I'm not sure that moving to 3D is the best move at the moment, given that real time 3D is still nowhere near good prerendered or handdrawn grapics. But it's more flexible, and hey, I thought we were in agreement that graphics should take second place to gameplay.
But you can't just write it off because previous graphical advances have left a sour taste in your mouth.

-Borghal

 

Yeah its just someone pretending to be Feargus...and FO3 is really been done like FO...sigh if only that were true.

 

Us moderators have awesome, terrible powers, such as viewing the IP of the poor souls unlucky enough to be posting on these forums. Oh, and I sent him an e-mail, too. :smile:

 

I suggest you all buy PORII in droves. Tell your friends to buy it,tell your family to buy it and buy a copy for your pets too. :smile:

Why you may ask ? Well PORII is turn based only and it's AD&D if it outsells BG II then BIS will have to sit up and take notice that TB is indeed still popular.
You can say how much better TB is till your blue in the face but gaming trends and sales figures (of recent meaning last 2 years) don't tell the same story.
If PORII disapears without a trace then it will just conform what Feargus said because the IE games are real time and they sell in droves.

PS. Dues Ex was voted PCZone RPG of the year for 2000.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: PaladinLord on 2001-05-15 07:43 ]</font>

 

I think Feargus would justify the sales of POR2 by saying, "Look, they bought it because it was 3D!"

POR2 has a real time mode also, if I'm not mistaken.

 

No, you can speed up the time between turns from anything from 6 seconds (or there abouts)to infinate but it is still totally turn based. You move in order and all actions are carried out before you move onto the next character.

FO3 is going to be 3d there really is no question of that of that anyway.
Whether or not it will have TB combat, a TB option or real time with pause depends on how well each does in other coming games I would think.

If Arcanum does well then both would seem attractive.
If PORII does well then TB would be attractive.
If niether outsell BG II then they will conclude that they may as well go with the real time/order pause because they are intimately familiar with it after so many IE games.

 

So I left work early yesterday to spend 2 hours in a dentist's chair then had to be at the Saturn dealership at 7am sharp to sit and read some book on financial planning for 2 hours so that they could inspect my car and make me late for work. While I'm obviously working very hard now, I'm just a wee bit little woozy what with the drugs and the lack of sleep and the numbers and crunching and froinlaven! Anywho, I would like to clarify my earlier roasting of Fallout2 just a little bit. Fallout2 in and of itself was not that bad a game, frequently enjoyable even. The problem with it was that it fell far short of what Fallout1 was, and even seemed to go in opposite directions in terms of quality of story and whatnot. Once you got to a point in the game it was like you could see a line drawn in sand where the creators of Fallout1 left and the design work was controlled by someone else. (FEARGUS! Heh, I just like saying that - narf!) They made it a very un-Fallout game by the time it was over, just crappy cheesy lame sci-fi. Fallout:Tactics only reinforced this theme. Sure, it was a passable game but as far as story went? Blah! Continuity? Blah! Out the window! Hearing what's his name talk about abuse to his 'little tribal' did not make me laugh. I made me go 'jesus they're making games for 12 year olds with Tom Green humour'. I'm in my mid-20's, I've got lots of disposable income, I've got a wang (er, desire) for Fallout games - WHY CAN'T YOU MARKET A GAME TO ME? What have I done to make you guys forsake me? Was it loyally playing your games? Sucking up one crappy title after another without complaint? Blindly having faith that you wouldn't let us down? Well, you have and you did and you're probably going to again. Simply put, I respect the business nature of the software market. You'll probably make more money marketing below the belt humour to the young teens of the world and leave the rest of us to choke on it. That's why I say THANK JEEBUS for Troika who are making a game (Yes, Arcanum - finally the topic returns to home!) that is going to respect me as an adult who enjoys games. Hear that? RESPECT. That's exactly what I don't have for Feargus, Black Isle and especially Interplay.

 

Pools of Radience also lacks a handful of the classes from 3rd Edition (hello, they're leaving out the Wizard class? Whaaaaaaaaat?) and some other things that lack from 3E D&D. On the other hand, Neverwinter Nights, being an officially licensed product since the get-go, will have everything (as far as I know). So what'll happen is people'll get snagged by the 3D graphics and complete setting of NWN and that'll inspire your beloved Fallout team to go 3D with even more fervor.

If they put out FO3 with nothing new except a different storyline, do you really think that everyone who bought FO and FO2 would buy it? If they got half the sales of the original FO that way, that'd be incredible. These changes BIS has in mind seem outrageous, but BIS is an amazing game studio, and they will make these changes work. Just put some faith in them.

As for brand recognition, you've already stated that a number of people would buy this just because it's a Fallout game. That's strength of brand. I know a number of people who're interested in Arcanum just because some of the members of Troika came from the Fallout team. You'd be surprised how strong brand recognition is in this industry. Mainstream consumers who don't know that much about the industry in general are more likely to pick up, say, a game with D&D on the box than some random other non-D&D RPG.

I personally would like to see something new in Fallout 3. Anyway, Feargus has said that that game isn't necessarily in development yet, so all this uproar is likely all for naught. Let's just follow the game's development and see what happens.

Tar

 

http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?top ... replies=45
Interesting reply from The Man Himself, Tim Cain:

 

I think he's going to enjoy it mainly because it'll just prove to us all that the rest of BIS has just been riding his coat tails and can't create anything outside of the "box"...

 

Blind following gave us Fallout Tactics. They pretty much said, "Don't worry, it'll be cool" with that title as well.

 

On the Fallout Tactics note:

Tim Cain's quote implies he doesn't consider it to be a real Fallout game. :smile:

 

Wish I weren't so late coming to the party but Borghal's comments are fairly close to some of what I was thinking while I was reading the entire thread.

My username should indicate to anyone that I'm a Fallout fan. I wrote my own walkthrough because of the inaccurate and humorless ones available and sent or printed it to many people. I've been using my username for some time now on every message board in which I participate, mostly in hopes of having people ask about it or at least remember the glory that was the Fallout universe. I know what I would like to see in Fallout 3. I don't imagine for a second that I can speak for any other fan and know that I would pre-order FO3 as soon as possible.

I also can't even comprehend the antagonism toward Torn this soon after announcement. Black Isle has yet to disappoint me and I am highly looking forward to the title. IWD and HoW have more story than nearly anyone wants to give them credit for, as well as beautiful music and artwork, and I believe Torn will continue these trends. The fact that a medieval version of Vaultboy exists and is just as humorous pleases me to no end. Let's see, perks and traits and the SPECIAL system -- yeah, I'd definitely hate to see those again. Feel free to flame since I doubt I'll be looking at this thread again.

P.S. I also have to say that I can't comprehend the personal attacks on Feargus. I'd love to see any of you say any of those things to his face. Geez.

 

The resentment towards TORN is an easy one.
"How dare BIS make another fantasy game when we want FO3" (not my opionion I snatched it off another board).
I saw some TORN stuff in PCZone and it's not hugely impressive but it is very early days. Feargus admitted that the TORN graphics "are not quite there yet" so I'm not concerned.

Feargus isn't half as scary looking as I imagined him to be :smile:
Why do people insult him ? Perhaps it makes them feel important or something who knows for sure.